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Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by keymone on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @05:28AM (#15548650)
you're welcome to die whenever you want, just don't speak for the rest of us.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by timthelion on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:17AM (#15548868)
Imagine a world in which Xi, Kim Jong *, and a host of other wealthy dictators were immortal, and the rest of us pee-ons were not. I believe that is the future of high tech immortality.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by lawlessone on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:04AM (#15549056)
Well the current Kim is 3rd in his line, so clearly they die.

And clearly death doesn't end the dictatorship.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by karmelapple on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @10:19AM (#15550299)
All medical advancements that enhance or prolong life get to be used first by wealthy individuals. Eventually, they reduce in price and reach more people.

Just because only a few people could afford a CT scan when it first came out doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep developing it for the wife benefits we will see in the future.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by erikj on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:57AM (#15549026)
They can still be shot in the face, stem cells won't help them with that.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by yAnonymous on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:05AM (#15549065)
Artificial body parts and a backup of the mind on USB...
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by knodi123 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @11:39AM (#15551005)
Mind backups do nothing for me. Imagine if your airplane ran out of fuel over the ocean. You're going to crash and die, so you get on the radio, and air traffic control says "don't worry, your estate already restored a backup of your mind into a cloned body. just go ahead and plow into the water at full speed, the new you is already awake and seems happy and comfortable."

Would you think "whew, I really dodged a bullet there", or would you think "fuck that clone, I don't want to die!" ?

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by Danihan on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:11PM (#15551375)
The former.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by alien_at_work on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:44PM (#15551682)
I can't grasp this view point. A clone with a "mind upload" is more like a twin. You'll still die and will not exist anymore to see what you're clone/twin does.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by knodi123 on Thursday October 26, 2017 @01:29AM (#15556578)
wow. so you're perfectly at peace with death if someone convincingly tells you that your family won't be able to tell the difference between the old you and your clone?

That whole mindset is utterly alien to me. I guess it all comes down to how you feel about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_identity

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by Danihan on Thursday October 26, 2017 @01:42PM (#15561215)
Not if someone "convincingly tells me," but if I've seen convincing evidence that demonstrates the backup is essentially identical, sure.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by jksmith on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @09:22AM (#15549843)
I think we'll see anti-aging treatments before that happens, so yes, a shot in the face would probably be effective until the singularity comes. Then a shot in the face will become some powershell script.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by devdoomari on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @09:43AM (#15550002)
hm... but wouldn't they still fear death-experience? also, mind-on-usb != my-mind imho... (it could be a ctrl-c,v of my mind, but can be said as someone else with my thoughts?)
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by brixon on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @09:48AM (#15550052)
Let's hope they only transfer at USB 1.0 speeds.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by bamboozled on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:36AM (#15548942)
I've been thinking about this lately too, it almost feels like we're here already.

I often read stories about innocent younger people dying from something tragic; However, why do I almost never wake up to, "<evil tyrannical dictator> has unexpectedly and peacefully passed away in their sleep?"

Brave new world I guess?

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by sleepychu on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:06AM (#15549070)
Lots of innocent young people, not many dictators
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by 0xdeadbeefbabe on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @11:45AM (#15551073)
The dictators started out innocent and young too.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by bamboozled on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:32AM (#15549199)
Fair point :)
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by datawarrior on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @11:33AM (#15550953)
Robert Mugabe is an example of this.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by mcgarnagle on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:38AM (#15548950)
I don't think immortal is the right word here. You can still die from physical harm, no matter how many stem cells you consume. So in theory if someone abused the pee-ons for enough time, probably one of them would get mad enough to overthrow the power. Just like many revolutions throughout history.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by timthelion on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:09AM (#15549087)
Most dynasties in history were overthrown by competing heirs, not the people. It is actually very rare for dictatorships to turn into democracies. Many reigns only end in death. Do you think Putin will ever be overthrown?
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by narag on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @09:58AM (#15550151)
It is actually very rare for dictatorships to turn into democracies.

In the last half century give or take some years, half of Europe and Latin America nations have successfully and peacefully made this transition. And only Venezuela has returned to dictatorship.

Do you think Putin will ever be overthrown?

No idea. Formal democracy is still in place, so there's hope.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by timthelion on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @10:06AM (#15550204)
But recorded history in Europe goes back some 3000 years.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by narag on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @11:11AM (#15550767)
Universal suffrage is as recent as 1906, and only for male voters was introduced in American and French revolutions. So with some back and forth, (modern, real) democracy has been steadly advancing since it was born two centuries ago, with a much clearer trend last half century.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by mcgarnagle on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @11:59AM (#15551216)
No, because he: a) has a very high approval rating, b) minimized a lot of corruption problems for Russia where people were stealing absolutely everywhere after the soviet collapse c) does not commit humanitarian crimes
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by klibertp on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:32PM (#15551571)
I'm not involved in any way, but from the news I watch, both a) and c) claims are debatable. I guess he's not worse than what he replaced, but that doesn't make him good. At least that's the spin in the media in my country, possibly very biased for a lot of reasons.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by andrewtbham on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @09:25AM (#15549868)
yeh the correct term is biological immortality.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_immortality

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by melling on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:31AM (#15549194)
nah, I’m imagining a different world. I get bored with always imagining the world where “only the rich...”.

At any rate, very few people are actually working on “immortality”. Most of us squander our time bullshitting on the Internet. There’s little danger of solving immortality for several generations.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by ourmandave on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:40AM (#15548956)
We can't all live forever. The Soylent Green factory needs "volunteers" 24/7.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by top256 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:24AM (#15548898)
kind of Warhammer 40K?
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by hohenheim on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @05:48AM (#15548750)
A better way to put is that, without death we wouldn't have progressed as a race as much as we have done. We need new people with fresh ideas to come to top, take higher roles and make radical decisions. People living longer will stay in power longer and keep the status quo alive. In a longer stretch, conservationism, which grows like age, is an impediment for innovation and progress, IMHO.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by crusso on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:20AM (#15549130)
If we were immortal, the birth rate would decline as people worried less about continuing through progeny and more about continuing through their own lives.

How many wars do you think anyone would want to fight if we didn't have an endless streams of the young who are willing to die on the battlefield?

How many murders are committed by people over 30 vs under? How many people die in car accidents after 30?

There's something to be said for having a world dominated by people who are mature and understand the value of their own lives.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by wu-ikkyu on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @09:45AM (#15550023)
>How many wars do you think anyone would want to fight if we didn't have an endless streams of the young who are willing to die on the battlefield?

We've got killer robots for that now.

>How many murders are committed by people over 30 vs under?

I'd guess the majority of murders have been caused by people over 30 declaring war.

>How many people die in car accidents after 30?

Self-driving cars sounds like a good solution

>There's something to be said for having a world dominated by people who are mature and understand the value of their own lives.

Yes, of course the elderly possess great wisdom, but they are also highly inflexible when it comes to thinking of new solutions to new problems. The imaginative power of the child is something highly undervalued and suppressed in our society.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by crusso on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @10:45AM (#15550542)
I'd guess the majority of murders have been caused by people over 30 declaring war.

Well, since US elected national office is pretty much 30 and over, that's the only way wars can be declared.

But there's a reason why there's the movie cliche of the old cautious king being toppled by the young warmonger. On average, young people are a lot more prone to violence. Put them in charge of a nation, and I have no doubt that wars would increase rather than decrease.

Yes, of course the elderly possess great wisdom, but they are also highly inflexible when it comes to thinking of new solutions to new problems.

But a lot of that is because your gray matter doesn't work as well as you become elderly. If that weren't the case, we could have young energetic minds that also are wise dominate in society.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by wu-ikkyu on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:12PM (#15551380)
What about the habitual thought patterns and prejudices that have been "hard wired" from the life experiences of the elderly, which make it so difficult to think outside the box?
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by crusso on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @03:53PM (#15553507)
If rejuvenation techniques keep the brain's neuroplasticity youthful, then those hard-wired experiences should be no worse than those of younger people.

Would a hard wired prejudice include being fundamentally biased against old people?

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by wu-ikkyu on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @04:13PM (#15553729)
Is there any evidence that stem cell therapy can eliminate old prejudices?
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by crusso on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @05:23PM (#15554408)
I think that this topic went from next year's stem cell therapy to "What if you could live forever" territory from the top comment way up there.

Within the context of the pie-in-the-sky subject we're discussing, calling for citations seems kind of pointless. We're all just speculating and talking about what-ifs.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by wu-ikkyu on Thursday October 26, 2017 @11:02AM (#15559421)
Yes indeed.

I suppose my main concern is that if learned prejudices (against race, religion, ideology, age, economic status, etc.) cannot be eliminated by regenerating brain matter, then a potentially fatal error could arise for society since some prejudices can be virtually insurmountable for many humans. Such an error is often solved naturally when the leaders of the previous age die out.

Just like when a computer system has become corrupted or broken, turning it off and on again can be the most simple and effective solution, so can death and rebirth be an effective solution for when our collective mental processes become corrupted.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by usrusr on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @08:56AM (#15549637)
> If we were immortal, the birth rate would decline

Would it? In modern, low reproduction societies the dominant interpretation of the universal "honour thy father and thy mother" focuses on care. Even the slightest resemblance to a chain of command that might be present earlier stops at adulthood. But with people forever overshadowed by their undying ancestors, we might see a massive resurgence of the competing interpretation which sees it as a natural power structure. If that happens, well, welcome to pyramid scheme hell.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by speedplane on Thursday October 26, 2017 @08:02AM (#15558103)
If you were immortal, it's not entirely clear you would be sane and reasonable after living for 200 years.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by Gatsky on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:58AM (#15549030)
I'm not sure about this argument. You could manage the issue in other ways eg enforced fixed terms for jobs.

Also, it's difficult to predict how immortality would affect human psychology, let alone how the technology would work. Perhaps we will be able to 'freeze' someone in their mid to late twenties, at some optimal point of physical health, maturity and risk taking behaviour.

I personally don't think we can take the very old and keep them alive forever. This will almost certainly result in a permanently sick state requiring constant therapy to maintain. The chance of getting cancer will approach unity at some point. Not exactly the ideal of immortal youth.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by hohenheim on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @08:49AM (#15549571)
You are correct, and that is basically what I am saying. But there is two sides to the coin. Good things will decline just like bad does.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by keymone on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:07AM (#15548830)
could you consider the notion, that all the progress and innovation impediments you link to age-related conservatism are actually at least partly related to the disease of aging itself? how would that change your opinion?
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by tormeh on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:58AM (#15549034)
Only partly agree. Even adults are very conservative. A bunch of forever-40 wouldn't work very well. Luckily this can be fixed. Experimental brain plasticity drugs also increases forgetfulness, which is what we really want. Knowing the old ways of doing things means that new ways won't be explored.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by keymone on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @07:45AM (#15549244)
i think there is a subtle difference between being conservative and being experienced.

experience gives, sometimes false, impression of knowing with some degree of certainty that a certain direction is wrong or won't yield results. young people don't have that bias.

conservatism is instead aversion to even agree with the results themselves if they don't conform with one's worldview.

this is pure speculation on my part though.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by jokoon on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @05:55AM (#15548777)
This sounds like darwinism. Evolution is a law of nature, not a law of society.

What you say is true for species that don't have language or civilization. But since humans have technology, evolution happens in our minds, not in our DNA.

And new ideas don't necessarily require new people.

> radical decisions

Like what?

> People living longer will stay in power longer and keep the status quo alive.

What kind of prediction is that?

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by hohenheim on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @09:02AM (#15549693)
> Like what? Take any norm breaking innovation in the pass 2000 years. Any idea that sounded arcane at its time: Earth is not Flat, its not the center of universe, light is a wave and a particle, etc. Perhaps decision was not the correct word to use, "ideas" would be better.

> What kind of prediction is that? A prediction like any other. I think we tend to become risk averse as we age, risk averse people don't like changes, without change you don't have a chance to fail, or succeed. If people to live longer I would think that every other stage of life would start to stretch. Take presidency as an example, its a four year cycle. If life expectancy was 200 years, would it not make sense to have presidents for 8 years? Would you retire after 30 years or 60 years?

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by jokoon on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @04:40PM (#15554042)
> I think we tend to become risk averse as we age

I don't think so. You're generalizing. Actually I would think that the opposite can happen.

Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by hacker_9 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @06:27AM (#15548903)
This makes the assumption that life is simply about progressing the human species. Progression to what though? One should aim to lead a happy life, of which making things better for the next generation is a byproduct.
Re:Anti-aging stem cell treatment proves successful in early... by hohenheim on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @08:54AM (#15549616)
Indeed. That is the assumption I made. Personally, for me life without progress is a meaningless one. But I can imagine the opposite as well. Once you have gotten all you need you try your best to preserve it as long as you can, anything new or different is a default no, because, why change something that is not broken? That is depressing, again from my perspective.