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Re:America has a monopoly problem by rayiner on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:18AM (#15541693)
They often are, because companies in highly competitive industries don’t have the excess profits to reinvest in research. Computing as we know it is largely the story of monopolies. Bell Labs bankrolled by the AT&T monopoly. Xerox PARC bankrolled by the Xerox copier monopoly. The Internet bankrolled by the ultimate monopoly (the military). The modern web bankrolled by the Google/Apple duopoly.
Re:America has a monopoly problem by jgmjgm on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:33AM (#15541818)
Yes, monopolies do have the resources to invest in R&D. The problem is that they often lack the incentive because they have control of a market.

Government regulations that mandate some return (think telecommunications services for those in rural areas, pollution standards, etc.) can provide an incentive for monopolists/oligopolists to perform better according to some criteria. The problem is those mandates are not what we would always consider "innovative". By definition, they are often designed to incrementally improve on the status quo.

The game of politics has an important role. When there are oligopolies in many industries it is not unusual to see regulators getting jobs at the very companies they regulate. Think of the ties between the SEC and finance, CRTC in Canada and the communications sector, etc. Monopolists have a way of cementing their position in the economy and reducing the mandates that governments place on them.

Re:America has a monopoly problem by wu-ikkyu on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:23AM (#15541736)
>companies in highly competitive industries don’t have the excess profits to reinvest in research.

On the flip side, monopolies often have little incentive to invest in improving their products/services, and find they can profit from making their products cheaper/worse.

Re:America has a monopoly problem by emodendroket on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:35AM (#15541836)
Or outright killing research that threatens their main revenue drivers. Like, OK, we eventually got digital cameras, but Kodak didn't do anything with it for a long time because they wanted to keep selling film. With graver consequences, Exxon decided to suppress its own findings about climate change.
Re:America has a monopoly problem by kazagistar on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:42AM (#15541894)
Another ongoing example: suppression of research into male birth control due to fears of cutting into profits from the cash cow that is female birth control.
Re:America has a monopoly problem by CPLX on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:27AM (#15541769)
> Bell Labs bankrolled by the AT&T monopoly.

Comparing one very effective and interesting skunkworks lab with the incredible explosion in choices and service in telecommunication, as well as drastically lower prices, that came when the monopoly was broken up?

I think you're demonstrating the anti-monopoly point handily.

Re:America has a monopoly problem by rayiner on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:37AM (#15541855)
The AT&T breakup destroyed the telecommunications industry. AT&T’s gold-plated POTS network was expensive, but for its time it was a technical marvel. Competitive industries don’t build stuff like that. There is a reason Apple and Samsung (huge, vertically integrated monopolies) produce the best phones.
Re:America has a monopoly problem by titzer on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:26AM (#15541760)
Yet all of those monopolies either imploded, had their markets simply dry up, were out-innovated by smaller competitors, or investors just moved onto hotter fads.

The crashing and burning of a big monopoly may very well be a healthy event; but oh the damage they do before then...

Re:America has a monopoly problem by emodendroket on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:37AM (#15541852)
Well it's not entirely clear that everything's great afterward either, since a lot of people are employed by any monopoly that crashes and burns and whole towns or regions can be devastated by that event.
Re:America has a monopoly problem by callinyouin on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:43AM (#15541896)
Kind of a hard argument to make when there are plenty of examples of contributions to computing that weren't bankrolled by monopolies. Just think about how much, especially in the early days, came out of academia alone. And I'm not sure where you get that the modern web has been bankrolled by Google and Apple when there are many, many other contributors.

IMO, innovation is usually fueled by competition. Where there's lots of competition, the need to innovate is the necessity for survival. I mean, how innovative was Microsoft in the 90's when they essentially had a monopoly on desktop computing? That's how we got stuck with IE 6 for so long...

Re:America has a monopoly problem by rayiner on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:56AM (#15542018)
> Just think about how much, especially in the early days, came out of academia alone.

Academic institutions are hugely monopolistic...

> Where there's lots of competition, the need to innovate is the necessity for survival.

That's the theory. In practice, competition drives bean-counting efficiency. See, e.g., Thinkpads before and after the Lenovo acquisition. Pretty much the only place you see innovation in that space is among companies that can carve out a niche based on brand or differentiating factors (Apple), or among companies that have a monopoly on a key piece of the supply chain (Intel, Microsoft).

Re:America has a monopoly problem by baursak on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:35AM (#15541842)
I guess as long as they are regulated, monopolies can be beneficial to the society overall, in many ways intangibly. Bell Labs is a great example of something that kept on giving (Unix, C, etc).

I wonder what could make something like Comcast into a "good monopoly" though.

Another aspect is that commercial competition, while generally accepted as a system that in the end delivers superior results, seems woefully inefficient in terms of waste of resources, as opposed to something like academic competition, were people freely reuse competitors' previous work.

Re:America has a monopoly problem by emodendroket on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:34AM (#15541823)
I don't really think it is fair or reasonable to gloss over the tremendous role of government research by just calling the military "the ultimate monopoly."
Re:America has a monopoly problem by mtberatwork on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:42AM (#15541895)
...or all of the universities that contributed a wealth of research to modern computing.
Re:America has a monopoly problem by pjc50 on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @10:31AM (#15541804)
AT&T of course had a strict ban on innovation by third parties on the phone network, up to the "hush-a-phone" case.