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Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by walshemj on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:14PM (#15537725)
Article is wrong if you had clearance you don't get to transfer it if you move to a civilian job is my understanding.

So is there an equivalent to List X companies in the USA who are allowed put staff through clearance.

And for TS clearance I doubt that any dual national other than those because of birth circumstances will be getting clearance any time soon which sucks for SV company employees who are immigrants

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by CalChris on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:33PM (#15537844)
You are mistaken. Security clearances go with the person and not the job. Indeed, there’s an entire industry available to people with the correct clearance. Yeah, there's paperwork to do when you move to a new job.

https://www.state.gov/m/ds/clearances/c10977.htm#9

https://www.clearancejobs.com/

For example, Edward Snowden had a clearance and worked for a private company, Booz Allen after first working for the NSA as a security guard then the CIA.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by itronitron on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:46PM (#15537932)
Security clearance does not stay with the person once they leave the job unless their new employer is (or is sponsored by) the same granting agency (i.e. DOD or DOE) and even then there is paperwork involved to set up the transfer.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by angry_octet on Monday October 23, 2017 @09:24PM (#15538464)
You are correct. The clearance comes in the form of a designated position with sponsored need to access certain cleared information. When you are no longer in that job you no longer have the need to access, and hence no active clearance.

When you start in a new job, if it is a security clearance designated position, your clearance can be reactivated. If there has been a gap between old and new your eligibility for a clearance will have to be re-evaluated, also when changing employers. (You could have been fired or left under a cloud, a significant marker for security concerns.)

All clearances require a government sponsor. So tech companies can't maintain someone with a clearance unless they are working on a govt program. IC may be a little more flexible on that.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by username223 on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:50PM (#15537963)
> Indeed, there’s an entire industry available to people with the correct clearance.

Indeed, one of my biggest career mistakes was not taking a job that would have included a Q clearance back before 9/11, when they were handed out much more quickly and freely.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by walshemj on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:41PM (#15537893)
That not how I read it you can transfer it to another federal job and a restricted set of civilian jobs It requires:

"an industrial or commercial contractor, licensee, certificate holder, or grantee of an agency, including all subcontractors; a personal services contractor; or any other category of person who acts for or on behalf of an agency as determined by the appropriate agency head."

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by eradicatethots on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:52PM (#15537976)
The first link you have makes it sound like clearance does not transfer, unless I’m reading it wrong
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by CalChris on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:58PM (#15538019)
Security clearances only apply to positions that fall under the purview of the federal government.

Under the purview doesn't mean that you are employed directly by the US Government. Again, from the example, Snowden had a clearance from his previous employment. Yeah, it had to get transferred but he didn't have to get re-cleared all over again.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by eradicatethots on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @12:55AM (#15539314)
Ah ok. Thanks for explaining that to me.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by clearthrowaway on Monday October 23, 2017 @09:30PM (#15538506)
Ok, a bunch of confusion in this thread...

A clearance is held by a specific agency. Say I work for contractor company C, on a contract with three-letter agency TLA. TLA grants me a clearance at whatever level, and they keep track of it. If I switch jobs to another position that requires a clearance -- maybe I go to company D, maybe I stay at C but on a contract for four-letter agency FLA [1] -- then TLA can transfer the clearance to the new agency FLA, and now FLA is the holder. Depending on the specifics of TLA and FLA, this can be "quick" (in government time), or in the worst cases it will take just as long as getting a clearance from scratch.

If I go to company D, but the new position does not require a clearance, then it becomes inactive. I can say I previously had a clearance, and if not much time has passed then getting it reactivated (if I go to a third job that needs it again) may be a relatively quick process. But if I am not at a job that is keeping it active, then I have no right to access classified data or anything.

In other words, if Facebook is hiring cleared people, they have to be working with a government agency that is holding the clearances.

On the other topic: obviously you have to be a US citizen. Immigrants/naturalized citizens are fine; I've known many cleared immigrants. Dual-citizenship I'm not sure about, you might have to renounce your old citizenship.

[1] This is an NGA joke. NGA: because the intelligence is silent. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Geospatial-Intelligen...

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by riot504 on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:24PM (#15537784)
Why would the US give a Top Secret clearance to an immigrant?

edit - You can't immigrate to a country then expect to receive a Top Secret clearance regardless if it is the US or any other country. I don't suspect Russia will give me a clearance if I were to immigrate and find employment at a tech company. There would be a major national security incident waiting to happen.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by Mz on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:26PM (#15537794)
https://www.state.gov/m/ds/clearances/c10977.htm#2

2. Do you have to be a U.S. citizen to receive a security clearance from the State Department?

As outlined in Executive Order 12968, Access to Classified Information, eligibility for access to classified information may only be granted to employees who are United States citizens. However, an exception is allowed in specific situations wherein there are compelling reasons for limited access to be granted to an immigrant alien or foreign national employee who possess a special expertise that is needed for specific programs, projects, contracts, licenses, certificates, or grants.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by riot504 on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:29PM (#15537819)
That is from the State Department. There are an array of different clearances.

http://www.dss.mil/psmo-i/ps_faqs.html#5

5. Are non-U.S. citizens eligible for a personnel security clearance? No. However, under rare circumstances, a non-U.S. citizen may be issued a Limited Access Authorization for access to classified information. Specific criteria and limitations are provided in the NISPOM. You may also contact your IS Rep for additional information.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by Mz on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:34PM (#15537853)
I don't really know the details. I just know my ex husband was career military and he once kind of hand waved off the importance of some security clearance label in, probably, some TV show with the factoid that basically, if you are in the military at all, you have some level of security clearance.

I don't know the nomenclature. I don't know if "Top Secret" is really super duper special or if that is, like, anyone above the rank of E-1. But I also know that, for example, one path to citizenship in the US is to serve in the military. So, if all members of the military have some degree of clearance and some are not citizens, then 1+1=2, I think.

But I googled to find a reliable source rather than give that anecdotal evidence. FWIW.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by metaphor on Monday October 23, 2017 @08:04PM (#15538061)
> ...one path to citizenship in the US is to serve in the military.

True statement.

> So, if all members of the military have some degree of clearance...

False assumption. Jobs that fall under services, personnel, public affairs, medical, contracting, vehicle maintenance, and supply come to mind. This is far from an exhaustive list and will vary in scope between branches of service.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by Mz on Monday October 23, 2017 @08:09PM (#15538083)
I have personally met foreign nationals who were infantrymen. It is possible my statement is overly broad. But if being in the infantry, like my ex was, grants some degree of clearance, then I have personally known foreign nationals in the US military who must have had a security clearance to do their job at all.

I based my remarks on a remark my ex made. I spelled that out as clearly as I could.

My conclusion is correct that my background knowledge suggests, yes, it is possible for immigrants to have some degree of security clearance. But, hey, I googled it just to be sure and posted that. And it is correct that it is possible for foreign nationals to have a clearance.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by angry_octet on Monday October 23, 2017 @09:29PM (#15538494)
People are confusing 'security clearance' with 'background investigation'. Non-citizens very rarely have any US security clearance.

It is normal for Army units to have many non-SECRET cleared members. It is one of the challenges of distributing ISR information to frontline units. Signals (communications) will tend to have clearances, and they couldn't progress if they couldn't get one. Officers are cleared.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by metaphor on Monday October 23, 2017 @09:58PM (#15538652)
I specifically disputed your assumption that all members of the military have some degree of clearance by pointing to select jobs which explicitly do not require any level of security clearance whatsoever. Nothing more.

Specifically addressing infantrymen (Army MOS 11x, Marines MOS 03xx), it's not difficult to imagine a case enlisted immigrant on a defined path towards naturalization being granted iterim clearance to train and perform basic routine duties, but is constrained to non-deployable status and can neither participate in classified briefings nor handle classified material pending valid JPAS investivation disposition...which is all theoretical motherhood and apple pie, except a security clearance isn't actually mandatory for many infantry MOSs.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by Mz on Monday October 23, 2017 @10:24PM (#15538745)
That is not my assumption. That is my recollection of what I was told by a knowledgeable individual whose word I trust on the subject.

It may be inaccurate. It is fine to share what you know. But, if you want to nitpick the hell out of a comment based on accuracy, you need to at least read the comment accurately and frame your objection or criticism with precise accuracy. If you cannot even accurately read and frame my comment while critiquing it, it basically gives me the impression that the whole point is to try do some kind of ugly social pecking order negging rather than improving accuracy of information in the discussion. And that generally does not go over well with me.

I am 100% fine with pedantry. If you know more than me, totes cool. But the inaccurate framing -- which suggests sloppy thinking on my part -- looks awfully suspicious from where I sit.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by riot504 on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:48PM (#15537946)
I was in the military with a secret clearance (standard I believe) and you are correct it is very mundane, nothing exciting. There were a few times I had to cover documents when people would come in and couldn't talk about certain projects, but it was nothing exciting. I believe intelligence is worthy at the aggregated level, not at the individual level most of us experience.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by Mz on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:51PM (#15537968)
There were a few times I had to cover documents when people would come in and couldn't talk about certain projects

Sounds like my old insurance job.

You have to comply with both HIPAA and Gramm-Leach-Bliley in insurance. Confidentiality is a big deal. Turning papers face down is standard practice.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by maxerickson on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:42PM (#15537894)
The first comment in the thread talks about dual nationals, presumably people who are naturalized US citizens.

Do you mean to apply everything you are saying to naturalized citizens?

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by riot504 on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:46PM (#15537934)
I misinterpreted the statement then. Naturalized citizens are different, I thought it was in reference to those who come here for a job, then require a security clearance. That would create conflict in my opinion.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by ajdlinux on Monday October 23, 2017 @08:19PM (#15538133)
As an Australian who lives in our national capital, I can assure you that our friendly local FVEY agency will happily employ Australian citizens at a Top Secret Positive Vetting level who are naturalised immigrants or dual citizens (a huge chunk of this country are dual British citizens, in particular). I get the impression that it makes your life a bit more difficult, but it's definitely achievable.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by angry_octet on Monday October 23, 2017 @09:30PM (#15538508)
PV is treated differently to lower levels.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by bandrami on Monday October 23, 2017 @09:11PM (#15538386)
I know literally hundreds of immigrants (meaning naturalized citizens) with TS/SCI clearance. Did you mean to say "non-citizen"?
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by notfromhere on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @11:23AM (#15542230)
If you're a naturalized citizen, you can get a clearance. Just be prepared to have a lot of rocks turned over
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by gervase on Monday October 23, 2017 @07:55PM (#15537999)
My understanding is that they actually exclude ALL dual nationals, even those whose citizenships were the result of birth circumstances, unless you are willing to formally renounce your second citizenship.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by notfromhere on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @11:26AM (#15542261)
Depends on what country. If you're a dual citizen with China/Russia/hostile power, you'll probably be forced to renounce or be denied a clearance. Folks from allied countries (NATO) often don't have to renounce it; I believe they ask if you'd be willing to, but you don't have to do it unless they ask
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by 113245 on Monday October 23, 2017 @08:05PM (#15538065)
Not true, you can hold a clearance and stay a dual citizen.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by nataz on Monday October 23, 2017 @10:03PM (#15538665)
It depends...some organizations require dual citizens to renounce their foreign citizenship before they get their clearance.
Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by nataz on Tuesday October 24, 2017 @09:30PM (#15546674)
Not sure why the down vote. It does depend on the sponsor, which country you hold a dual citizenship with, and what level of clearance you are trying to obtain.

The below poster is incorrect. In order to move forward in the process in some cases you will need to formally renounce and physically destroy you foreign passport in front of your investigator.

I know that sounds bad, but keep in mind no one is forcing people to obtain a clearance.

Re:Tech Firms Seek Washington’s Prized Asset: Top-Secret Cle... by Cyph0n on Monday October 23, 2017 @10:56PM (#15538855)
From what I understand, the worst case is that they confiscate your other passport(s) to ensure that you do not enter or exit the US with a non-US passport. I could be wrong though.