I guess you have never had depression then. This is the kind of comment that only makes depressed people feel worse. It's like saying to a depressed person, come on just cheer up. Criticism or kicking someone when they are down with depression like you just did is unwarranted, mean and dangerous.

I don't think that was costcopizza's intention. As someone who has struggled with severe depression for a long time, I can attest to his suggestion being helpful. It can be incredibly difficult to do, but obligating myself to various volunteer opportunities (usually by making the commitment during rather well feeling day/moment/episode) has helped immensely. For me it helps to take my mind off my own problems, and even if only temporary, it's usually helpful.

My critique wasn't on the volunteering aspect, I agree that's helpful, it was on calling depressed people narcissistic.

After seeing the reactions to his comment, I felt it would be helpful to emphasize both: the possible benifits of his suggestion, and that I don't think he intended to be critical of depressed people or kick them while they're down. By calling depression "a narcissistic condition", many people seemed to be viewing it that way.

Thanks for the reply.

I said depression is narcissistic, not those with depression. That's a damn big distinction.

In fact I am diagnosed with depression myself, have had suicidal ideation, and still relapse.

When I look back at my darkest times I think volunteering kept me alive. I don't know whats harmful about suggesting that. The big D saps the life out of you, working with others who have their struggles too gives a closed-off negative feedback looped mind just a hint of perspective.

Everyone's depression is different, which is why I ended my comment with the fact that some people's condition doesn't allow them the luxury to get out of bed.

I think it was a poor word choice, but it makes sense. I believe, when parent said depression is narcissistic, he meant that it causes you to ruminate on your own self worth constantly. Narcissism is typically associated with self aggrandizing, but ultimately what's going on is that the part of your brain that controls your self narrative is overactive. That can just as easily manifest as obsessive worry over your perceived failings and inadequacies.

I think the replies critical of your comment are unfair. In my read, it is not critical of depressed people. To be depressed _is_ to be very self absorbed. It isn't a character flaw, it's a result of the condition.

The advice to make yourself do things can be helpful. Speaking personally, in periods of depression I have left the house less because of pessimism about how good a time it would be, or whether it'd be worthwhile. It's helpful, if you can, to ignore those feelings and make yourself do things, for the simple fact that it's good for you.

As you say, "if you can" is the rub.

A relevant comic (from akimbocomics.com):

https://i.imgur.com/8EqmrfF.jpg

You really don't have any idea what depression is or feels like, do you?

You seem to be implying that depressed people are selfish, which is generally unhelpful, false, and disrespectful to those who have suffered.

I didn't read it as selfish or disrespectful, but perhaps false with regards to true depression?

Really don't know much about clinical depression, but heartbreak and mild depression that average people go through can I've found to be lessened by helping others. Probably mainly because it takes your mind off of the fact, and also because you feel fulfilled in the end. Two things that don't happen if you sit at home sulking alone and constantly replaying your past over and over.

As you touch on at the end, there's a bootstrapping problem here.

If people could follow this advice, they wouldn't need it. :-(

I think you should be a lot more careful about throwing around terms like "extremely narcissistic", which both has a technical definition in psychology, and also an enormous amount of emotionally loaded subtext.

I also think you should be a lot more careful about advising people what to do. It comes across as both bossy and judgmental.

> Depression is an extremely narcissistic condition, being stuck in your mind with countless loops of thoughts about you that are unrealistically negative.

I’m sure there’s some appropriate label for this behavior, but “depression” isn’t (I say this as someone who has been diagnosed with chronic episodes of depression).

To cut through any biases, let me relate something analogous from my life, as an alternative to speaking directly about depression itself (while hopefully conveying the same underlying lack of agency in my predicimate).

Two years ago, I started feeling off. Not emotionally, but physically and cognitively. My drive (both platonic and sexual) started diminishing (but nothing catastrophic - at first). I had several labs done at the time to assess my health (basic CBC and various hormones) to keep tabs on what was going on in my body. Things quickly turned bad. Within weeks I found myself shivering and sweating puddles, throbbing pain radiating throughout my body. The lymph nodes located in my groin swelled so much as to not only be palpable, but protruding from under my skin at about the size of ping pong balls, like little mole hills.

The fever went away about a week or two later; however, for months I was incredibly prone to motion sickness and daylight would give me intense headaches. From then - and to this day - I went from being a model of fitness to being a broken run down person. Previously, I had had boundless energy, and I saw beauty in everything - like some wild eyed child experiencing all the little joys of the world for the first time. On top of that, I had a sexual appetite that was of such comically high proportion that my friends would tease me relentlessly.

It’s two years since that fever. My liver enzymes are chronically elevated many, many times outside of the reference range. My testosterone, leutenizing hormone (and several others) have plummeted by 30-40%. Most days my body is stiff, inflamed and I ache from head to toe. I’m often spacey, like I’m mentally walking through a thick fog - cognitively, I’m a shell of my former self. Walking up stairs is often a monumental effort. My sex drive went from being so high that it posed logistical problems, to zero drive - or worse, really - without the drive/desire, sex is really just messy and tiresome.

The doctors I’ve seen agree that I unoquivically have some real health issue, as evident in my labs and many, many follow ups, but no one can tell me why things are wrong, nor how to fix me.

I didn’t choose to be broken. I didn’t choose to lose my sex life. I didn’t choose to be constantly fatigued. I didn’t choose to loose my bouncy energetic personality that I was known for. This is all despite my attitude being solid. I have a great job, an awesome caring girlfriend, a supportive family, I live in a fantastic city (Brooklyn) with tons of awesome stuff going on. And yet I feel emotionally numb (not depressed - as I’ve been told by a professional); I just don’t feel stimulated by the same things I used to. Not that I think any less of those things.

I’d recommend you be a little more careful with your use of the word depression. You can’t reduce it to “whiny self loathing” (though that’s certainly a thing for some people, but again, that’s not what depression means). Some people are, of no fault of their own, unhealthy. For some it may be something that’s easily relatable because it shows up in, say, a scan (e.g. cancer), and for others it might be that they physiologically can not experience the same positive emotions that you would given the same stimulus.

(Typing from phone... sorry if any of this is mistyped or shittily written.)

As someone with depression and no motivation: fuck you.

That's all.

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