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Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by Animats on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @04:55PM (#15288730)
Harvard's graduation rate is 97.5%. Yale 97%. Princeton 96.9%. It's hard to flunk out of the Ivy League.

Non Ivy League highly selective schools: Caltech 92.3%. Stanford 93%. MIT 92.2%. UC Berkeley: 90.9%. Low 90% success rate is normal there.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by Gibbon1 on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @06:44PM (#15289435)
I just remember the difference between Stanford 30 years ago and San Jose State.

At Stanford students that were failing a class or getting a grade that was too low would just drop it and retake it the next semester. At San Jose State you couldn't drop a class after the first two days. Stanford you could retake a class for a higher grade. SJSU, you could retake a class if the grade was lower than a C. But they'd average the two grades.

San Jose States Engineering department also graded on a curve, no exceptions. Only 5-8 people out of a class of 30 was going to get an A.

Also at San Jose State if your grades dropped too low you didn't get put on academic probation, you were gone.

Not just picking on Stanford, I've heard similar reports from people that went to other high ranked schools.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by quuquuquu on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @09:39PM (#15290103)
That sounds like a hellacious place to attend school.

That's like judging an engineer based on a blended average of their output, for 3 months, compared to Nikola Tesla.

If you can't compete with him, sorry, it's gonna have to be a B-.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by Gibbon1 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @12:54AM (#15290947)
The deal is when you grade on a curve a B- means something other than 'totally failed' or as an old instructor of mine said, back when I went to school a B was a good grade.

Also my mothers comment was if everyone does really really well on a test then it wasn't hard enough. The reverse is sort of true. If everyone does poorly then either the test test was too hard or the instructor failed to teach the material.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by quuquuquu on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @04:44AM (#15291774)
While I agree with you, the biased reader of my job application is looking for any reason to deny me :)
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by moretai on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @11:16PM (#15290515)
Yeah, is there a reason to grade on a curve? I don't understand the competition if it the point is to understand the material. There is no evidence that the real world operates on a meritocracy.
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by akhilcacharya on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:00AM (#15291828)
And what happens after you graduate?

No matter if you got a 4.0, you're still never going to be graded the same as a Stanford grad*. It's set for life (unless you go to Stanford for a MS/PhD..)

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by WalterBright on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @06:17PM (#15289287)
I wonder how they're measuring it. I attended Caltech in the 70s, and the percent who entered as freshman and graduated as seniors was much lower. You could see it just in the number of students at each level, it declined every year.
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by blacksmythe on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @08:03PM (#15289755)
The Caltech graduation rate back then said to be on the order of 66%.

The saying at Frosh camp was 'Look to your left. Look to your right. One of you is not going to graduate'.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by WalterBright on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @10:38PM (#15290353)
66% sounds about right. People left for all sorts of reasons, not just flunking out.

I wonder what has changed since then to so drastically change the graduation rate.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by cm2187 on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:15PM (#15288878)
Can it have something to do with higher tuition fees too?
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by plussed_reader on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:19PM (#15288917)
Why would it?
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by cm2187 on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:25PM (#15288958)
If they pay higher tuition fees, it should put more pressure on the kids (through their parents or their creditor) to graduate.
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by jeremiep on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:32PM (#15289019)
For a lot of students its their parents paying, they'll only realize the value of it all decades later.
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by collegestoo on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:33PM (#15289023)
This is also true of colleges to return a good return on investment. Also, their financial aid is already comparable (thinking of Standord specifically); I don't think it makes sense to speculate in the direction you're speculating any more than other directions.
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by jmgrosen on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @06:28PM (#15289361)
Those all have ~roughly equal tuition (except Berkeley, which is far less for in-state students).
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by ssanders82 on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:23PM (#15288947)
Sunk cost
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by dqpb on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:30PM (#15289004)
CMU: 88.1%
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by davidgay on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @06:35PM (#15289390)
High. EPFL: 55% (http://sae.epfl.ch/echec-statistiques).

[I've never heard any very good arguments for either high or low pass rates]

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by ScotterC on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:45PM (#15289091)
I immediately looked it up too ;)
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by akhilcacharya on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:01AM (#15291830)
NC State (my school) - 74.3%.

sigh

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by milkywayz on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @07:32PM (#15289648)
RIT 63.2%.
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by nnfy on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @05:35PM (#15289041)
It could also be at least partly related to higher selectivity and more financial aid, and/or rich parents, that make school easier.

But I dont actually know what goes on in ivy and off ivy league elite schools.

Also consider that these may just be better run schools which also provide more and more useful assistance to students.

Edit: I would like to add I think this article title is extremely clickbaity, and plays on the recently resurgent class warfare phenomenon. It pains me that articles like this, from sources like this, are becoming normalized and even acceptable on HN. There's no merit to this biased pile of shit. And I'm not an ivy league graduate having a security crisis. Journalism should be objective.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by grzm on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @06:31PM (#15289377)
One of the issues I think is that people no longer are making a distinction between opinion pieces (which this is) and articles. They're only looking at the domain name. Given that you describe it as an article, might you have done the same? (This isn't meant as a slight. We all have overlooked things at one time or another.) I'm not sure how to rectify this. To their credit, the publications still label them as such. Perhaps the labels should be larger.
Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by kafkaesq on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @06:29PM (#15289364)
There's no merit to this biased pile of shit.

You may no particularly like the author's point of view -- but you looked carefully, you might have noticed it was placed in he "Perspective" section, which as the name implies, is dedicated to expressing what are commonly known as "points of view" -- otherwise known as "biases". Which, forming the very core of our cognitive processes as they do, are very far from flaws -- an in fact, when used properly, not just useful, but absolutely crucial to one's survival in this murky, deeply ambiguous and ambivalent world of ours.

And at least the author gave some supporting observations to back up their (clearly labeled as such) point of view. OTOH the sentence you're offering above provides no insights or justifications; it is, quite literally, a pure expletive.

Journalism should be objective.

Should it, now?

“So much for Objective Journalism. Don't bother to look for it here--not under any byline of mine; or anyone else I can think of. With the possible exception of things like box scores, race results, and stock market tabulations, there is no such thing as Objective Journalism. The phrase itself is a pompous contradiction in terms.”

-- Hunter S Thompson

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by nnfy on Tuesday September 19, 2017 @08:05PM (#15289774)
The fact that journalists are inherently biased as humans does not imply that we should not strive toward the opposite.

I dont care either way for the author's point of view. I am bothered by the fact that a news source publishes so much in opinion, and that people end up more polarized after the article, not because of its factual content, but because of its vitriol.

I believe it irresponsible to create and publish content like this, because it amounts to propaganda - I dont care side of our false dichotomy you are on, huff post is up there with breibart.

Opinion pieces should not affect our beliefs as much as they do, but let's be real, communities feed off of opinion pieces. We all do, and I come to HN specifically to minimize my exposure to feel good emotional reinforcement that leads to irrational thinking.

Sorry for the rant.

Edit: your choice of quote may be more effective than you realize, I am a big fan of Thompson's persona. Ironic, I know.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by kafkaesq on Friday September 22, 2017 @11:17AM (#15312922)
I think I get where you're coming from. But I didn't see the piece as 'vitriol', and I don't see HuffPo (while often annoying) as being anything like Breitbart (which puts out nothing but pure drivel and propaganda). Or the WaPo as comparable to either of those two.

Sorry for the rant.

Nothing to be sorry for; you're just being honest (both intellectually and in your opinions). And HST himself would probably agree that that's all that matters.

Re:What the elite expect and receive from an Ivy League educ... by akhilcacharya on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:02AM (#15291837)
"Actually, there’s been class warfare going on for the last 20 years, and my class has won."

- Warren Buffet

[0]: https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/post/theres-b...