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A comment on Where in Europe is electric car a good idea?.

Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by Reason077 on Saturday August 26, 2017 @03:48PM (#15107020)
Electric vehicles can be charged overnight and at off-peak times, so it's reasonable to assume they use a higher-than-average share of low-carbon energy.

For example, around 50% of the UK's electricity production is from low-carbon sources (renewables and nuclear). But a much higher percentage of off-peak power is low-carbon. After midnight, close to 100% of the grid is low-carbon because the gas turbines spin down while the wind turbines and nuclear reactors keep running. EVs and smart chargers/smart grids will help us make better use of clean off-peak power!

Also, grids will continue to get cleaner over time. An EV purchased today will have lower and lower emissions as it ages, but a combustion vehicle will only get worse!

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by CalChris on Saturday August 26, 2017 @04:09PM (#15107165)
This. It isn't clear how these CO2/km numbers were derived. Are they a function of average energy generation source mixes or are they taking into consideration when EVs are charged. Average would be more correct for Bitcoin mining.

PGE has an EV rate plan [1] which charges a lot less during off peak (midnight to 6am) than during the day.

[1] https://www.pge.com/en_US/residential/rate-plans/rate-plan-o...

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by dmurray on Saturday August 26, 2017 @05:45PM (#15107662)
Bitcoin miners would also use electricity at low peak times, unless the cost of hardware dominates the cost of electricity. In practice the mining operations seem to be concentrated near hydro plants in China, where there is an oversupply of carbon neutral electric power.
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by davedx on Sunday August 27, 2017 @09:34AM (#15110707)
Exactly. The company I work for is currently developing a smart charging service that deliberately delays charging until rates are lowest and electricity generation is cleanest. One of our primary objectives is to reduce gas peaker usage and shift load to renewables. It also results in payouts for the EV owners of course.
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by Havoc on Saturday August 26, 2017 @04:07PM (#15107152)
Yup. There is so much potential for improvement from just flattening out peaks of what we've got already.
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by captainmuon on Sunday August 27, 2017 @03:59AM (#15109652)
Yeah, but does anybody do that?

If I had an electric car, I'd charge it overnight. I don't get different pricing at different times. There has been talk of introducing that for decades now (in Germany), but I'm not sure it is coming soon, nor that I'd like it. Probably, it would become just more expensive when I need it most, without being able to change my usage patterns much.

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by fnoobor on Sunday August 27, 2017 @05:30AM (#15109933)
In Germany you can request an off-peak meter in addition to your normal power meter. Alternatively, you can get a power meter that is able to count two tariffs in one device.

There is no "talk of introducing this for decades" since it exists since decades.

Here's all you need to know: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niedertarifstrom

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by the_mitsuhiko on Sunday August 27, 2017 @05:02AM (#15109830)
Off peak pricing was ling already available with two meters ans quite common. Now with smart meters you can have hourly pricing.
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by gchadwick on Sunday August 27, 2017 @04:14AM (#15109693)
In the UK off peak tariffs are available. It's a bit of a pain because it requires two meters but if someone was installing an electric charging point I imagine many would add an economy 7 (the name of the off peak tariff) meter at the same time.
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by icebraining on Sunday August 27, 2017 @05:36AM (#15109952)
it requires two meters

Why?! Two-rate meters have been around for decades, long before they went digital.

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by gchadwick on Sunday August 27, 2017 @07:14AM (#15110237)
Ok, it may require changing to a two rate meter then :)

Never actually used an economy 7 tariff myself so I don't know the details but the point is most houses in the UK aren't equipped to have one. However a home-owner choosing to install a charging point for an electric vehicle will probably switch to a suitable metering setup for economy 7 whilst they're at it.

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by Reason077 on Sunday August 27, 2017 @06:56PM (#15113265)
"Never actually used an economy 7 tariff myself so I don't know the details but the point is most houses in the UK aren't equipped to have one."

All homes in Britain will have smart meters installed by 2020:

https://www.smartenergygb.org/en/smart-future/about-the-roll...

These support Economy 7, as well as whatever other variable tariffs that energy companies dream up in the future.

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by merb on Sunday August 27, 2017 @06:09AM (#15110058)
also: energy on the grid can and will be optimized (we see that trend in germany, however it begins really slowly), however forcing car owners to use the new diesel/gasoline car techology will probably not happen. in the long term the ev will be better anyway.
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by kzrdude on Sunday August 27, 2017 @04:25AM (#15109719)
Don't the wind turbines have their lowest production during the night too, on average?
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by kzrdude on Sunday August 27, 2017 @04:27AM (#15109726)
Apparently not. I was under the impression that winds, being powered by temperature differences and energy input into the weather system from the sun, would calm at night.

Apparently the wind producers don't experience anything like that.

https://www.llnl.gov/news/power-generation-blowing-wind

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/wind-power-turbin...

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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by walshemj on Sunday August 27, 2017 @07:28AM (#15110283)
yes but for non trivial us of ev's you have to upgrade the grid and domestic supply which is not going to be cheap and don't for get that a lot of uk housing stock (flats older houses) does not have of street parking
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Re:Where in Europe is electric car a good idea? by davedx on Sunday August 27, 2017 @09:36AM (#15110715)
Yep, EV usage will greatly increase electricity demand. There are big infrastructure costs there. Interesting, challenging times ahead.
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