News for hackers. Stuff that matters.

A comment on Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade authorities. Parent comment

Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by pvg on Thursday May 04, 2017 @07:54PM (#14269970)
Nobody was forcing Uber to do anything. They were trying to deny agents of public regulatory bodies the ability to assess them. That isn't any kind of 'right'.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by sushid on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:10PM (#14270077)
I'm no fan of Uber, but if there are LEOs trying to use your product fraudulently (e.g. fake data, ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars), doesn't it make sense to try and stop this sort of operation?

If you had LEOs peering into your office windows (legal, but undesirable), wouldn't you want to at least have a blind to try and stop them from peeking?

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by dragonwriter on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:26PM (#14270177)
> I'm no fan of Uber, but if there are LEOs trying to use your product fraudulently (e.g. fake data, ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars), doesn't it make sense to try and stop this sort of operation?

If it's actually fraudulent, then, yes, you should stop it by suing and getting an injunction against the illegal government action.

If it's just enforcing the law that you are breaking, maybe you should quit breaking the law rather than engaging in elaborate technical means to conceal the violation, and expecting that won't cause additional problems when it is discovered.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by pvg on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:23PM (#14270154)
ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars

Enforcement is not 'fraudulent use'. These analogies are very strained while the thing that took place is very simple.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by pyre on Thursday May 04, 2017 @10:40PM (#14270756)
> use your product fraudulently

If a LEO lies to you during the course of an investigation, do you think that you will be able to successfully claim that as fraud?

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by JustSomeNobody on Friday May 05, 2017 @08:06AM (#14272763)
If you have committed a crime and they are peering into the windows to see if you are still committing the crime, putting up blinds with the intent to block their view would be obstruction and you'd now be committing another crime.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by johncolanduoni on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:26PM (#14270183)
A blind != a hologram projecting a false image while you do something illegal inside.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by MichaelGG on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:59PM (#14270344)
But even that would be OK wouldn't it? Writing "Flour" on a bag before putting contraband powder in it shouldn't be illegal.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by npizzolato on Friday May 05, 2017 @01:59AM (#14271413)
If you do that with the intention of passing through a checkpoint to hide your contraband, why shouldn't that be a crime?
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by Dylan16807 on Friday May 05, 2017 @03:02PM (#14275978)
Why should a bag of drugs labeled "drugs" be less illegal than a bag of drugs labeled "not drugs"?

The labeling can serve as evidence toward the smuggling case without needing to be its own crime.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by princeb on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:23PM (#14270158)
no, doesn't really make sense.

that'll be like arthur andersen shredding enron's financial accounts. can't investigate if there's nothing to investigate!

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by dangero on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:00PM (#14270013)
"right" is a moral judgement. It depends on whether you see this as civil disobedience. It may be "right" and also illegal at the same time.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by RcouF1uZ4gsC on Thursday May 04, 2017 @09:09PM (#14270385)
If you look at civil disobedience as practiced by Martin Luther King, Jr and Gandhi, it was to highlight injustice by disobeying the law in question, and then accepting the full consequences of breaking the law. Breaking a law you dont like, doing shady things to avoid getting caught, and raising billions in investments is not at like civil disobedience and only cheapens the real civil disobedience that addressed great injustice at great personal cost to the people involved.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by sqeaky on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:06PM (#14270047)
"Civil disobedience" is a term and group of actions used when fighting for racial equality during the civil rights movement. Equating that with anything uber, a multibillion international company, does is kind of gross.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by sfilargi on Thursday May 04, 2017 @09:35PM (#14270493)
I may be wrong but I don't think you can label something as "civil disobedience" when it is done by a corporation or when it is done for profit.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by wavefunction on Thursday May 04, 2017 @10:16PM (#14270652)
I believe you to be correct in your understanding of what constitutes civil disobedience.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by Dangeranger on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:12PM (#14270084)
The law makes it pretty clear whether a business has the "right" to interfere with a criminal investigation.

Disagreeing with a law doesn't give you the "right" to not follow the law.

[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by wavefunction on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:21PM (#14270142)
Yeah but Uber's behavior is definitely wrong.
[ Parent | on HN ]
Re:Uber faces criminal probe over software used to evade aut... by pvg on Thursday May 04, 2017 @08:17PM (#14270113)
Since you can apply this to pretty much anything, this analysis is neither particularly insightful nor useful. It's a godwining in which you replace Hitler with Thoreau.
[ Parent | on HN ]