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Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by ryandrake on Saturday December 10, 2016 @12:37PM (#13146761)
It's not that the teachers _dislike_ him, it's that they are frustrated that he is not following the curriculum and conforming to the lesson sequence and timeframe planned for.

I found US public school education was not about learning and mastery. It's about conformity and obedience. Learning the subject matter is secondary--the key to succeeding at this institution is to do things in the expected way, at the expected pace, even if it is mind-numbingly verbose and slow. It's a hack: You learn the expectations and do the bare minimum of what is precisely expected, because both less than and greater than the bare minimum will be penalized. I had a rough time in school until I grokked this hack.

Do your homework. It's easy of course, just takes a long time to do since so much gets assigned. The point of doing homework is not to learn, it's to show obedience--you were told to do the homework and you did it.

Show your work. It doesn't matter if you can do division in your head, kid. You're expected to write down the specified intermediate steps so just turn your brain off and do it. The point is to follow the prescribed process, not to master the subject.

Class participation. This is a gift to the outgoing/popular/sports kids to inflate their grades. Just figure out how many times you need to say something in order to get full credit, then raise your hand and say something (anything, it usually doesn't matter) that amount of times.

Public schooling is a series of hoops that you need to jump through at no slower or faster than the prescribed pace. The smart kids figure this out. The REALLY smart kids tend not to figure it out unfortunately.

Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by cmrdporcupine on Saturday December 10, 2016 @01:07PM (#13146922)
Unfortunately all these 'lessons' mimic skills that will be needed by adults in the corporate world. Work in groups even when they're dysfunctional, show off and write lots of supporting documentation to get yourself promoted, and learn to tolerate seemingly arbitrary or broken management decisions.
Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by ryandrake on Saturday December 10, 2016 @01:25PM (#13147027)
I don't know if it's unfortunate. It's certainly by design. The societal purpose of public schooling is to prepare the future service workers and corporate drones of America to follow procedures and not get too curious. The (pre-determined) future leaders of America have their own track with private/prep schools, tutors, and Ivy League higher-ed, where the focus/purpose is, I would imagine, very different.
Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by fjdlwlv on Saturday December 10, 2016 @04:13PM (#13147945)
This is a silly myth. The privileged upper class don't get a special better-designrf education, they get a professional network that puts them in power regardless of their education. There's no special high school class that teaches "skills for becoming a CEO or a Congressperson".
Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by jacobolus on Saturday December 10, 2016 @08:53PM (#13149139)
I went to a better-than-average public high school and then a top tier college and I spent lots of time with people who went to prep school. There are substantial differences between prep school vs. public school in a rich well educated area vs. public school in a poor area.

Prep schools are most certainly better (on average) at teaching students to be assertive, seek out opportunities, bend rules, etc. The coursework is harder and more engaging than even top-track classes at good public high schools. On average students get more individual attention from teachers.

Likewise, there is a wide gap between work difficulty and quantity and expected levels of preparation at top tier colleges vs. average colleges. At top tier colleges, the typical student is incredibly ambitious, and there is a categorical difference between the extent to which typical students seek leadership opportunities and pursue impressive goals. (This is not to diminish the work of typical students at average schools, many of whom come from difficult circumstances and must struggle to pay the bills, etc. And of course there are some amazingly ambitious and talented students even at mediocre schools who do amazing work.)

There are surely still many problems with even the best schools, but the difference is by no means limited to professional networks.

Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by jdietrich on Saturday December 10, 2016 @09:23PM (#13149240)
Read up on English public (private) schools like Eton or Harrow. The privileged upper class do indeed get a special better-designed education.

These schools are factories for CEOs and politicians. They have the absolute best teaching, the best resources, a culture that not only encourages high achievement but expects it. If an Etonian or Harrovian says that he wants to be Prime Minister, nobody bats an eyelid - the odds are fairly good that he might well be.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tcRXHyEKC4

Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by wnevets on Saturday December 10, 2016 @04:22PM (#13147982)
While true, those that come from real money aren't sitting a class room with 30+ other students.
Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by mathperson on Saturday December 10, 2016 @04:54PM (#13148155)
no they also do so. its just that the class is more like 20 and the teacher is very good. -source have sat in public school (also a VERY well funded publisc school) class with friends with parent's net worth > 90 million
Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by mrottenkolber on Saturday December 10, 2016 @09:10PM (#13149204)
I know a lot of people who did what you recommend and it broke them all mentally. Its really hard to regain self respect and adjust back to reality when you obey for 10+ years.

So I will give the opposite advice: Rebel. Be a pain. Skip class. Don't get into college.

If you're unlucky that might close lots of career gates, but at least you got your sanity, and that's the most important thing. A healthy mind is worth a bunch.

Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by WalterBright on Saturday December 10, 2016 @07:40PM (#13148883)
> It doesn't matter if you can do division in your head, kid. You're expected to write down the specified intermediate steps so just turn your brain off and do it. The point is to follow the prescribed process, not to master the subject.

Some people can intuitively do division in their head for simple problems, but if they don't learn the mechanical algorithm for it, they are unable to do more complex division.

BTW, I've implemented divide routines in assembler before CPUs had a divide instruction. I used the same algorithm I learned in 3rd grade. Polynomial division also uses the same algorithm.

There is a point to learning an algorithm, even if you already know the answer.

Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by Hyperborian on Saturday December 10, 2016 @06:06PM (#13148432)
> I found US public school education was not about learning and mastery. It's about conformity and obedience.

Bingo.

There has been much improvement in curriculum over the years, certainly, but the structure of the American school system is still basically the same one that was originally designed expressly to produce a body of conforming and obedient factory workers with a consistent and predicable level of skills.

Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by tunap on Saturday December 10, 2016 @03:07PM (#13147617)
My math teachers at two different high schools often had library passes ready for me on non-test/quiz days. All I had to do was hand in tomorrows homework assignment today. I had to do all the questions, they wouldn't tell me what cherry-picked questions would be assigned. Worked out well to have me not distracting classtime but I never got any encouragement to continue into advanced maths. My freshman college counselor told me all my prerequisites had been satisfied in HS, don't bother taking more maths. 18yo me was happy to hear it. Meh.
Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by cryptarch on Saturday December 10, 2016 @01:18PM (#13146988)
I think that at most public schools there are two separate paths of least resistance:

* Do most of your homework and get acceptable grades. This is what most students do.

* Don't do jack and be consistent. Many teachers will give up if you never do homework, and if you skip enough classes there won't be enough time to sit out all your due detention. It's also well possible that your school has a leaky detention administration and it ends up never happening.

Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by jddjdbdbd3 on Saturday December 10, 2016 @05:35PM (#13148312)
I chose path b. Never did homework. I always forgot it. If you passively deflect enough, people will eventually just give up. Especially when you get good to excellent grades in the exams. The same worked at university. Dont go to lectures, dont do coursework or go to practicals. Get the past exam papers and learn to solve them over a month to two months before the exams. Solid 2.1, job done. Except I was utterly miserible through out that whole time. Lol. I could have been working in theoretical physics had my childhood not been a car wreck. Nope, doing web development, so dull :(
Re:Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf] by clairity on Saturday December 10, 2016 @01:10PM (#13146935)
as i learned when i went to college, figuring out this hack was actually not so clever unless you find ways to keep learning and improving despite the imposed limitations.