That seems a strange place to identify hypocrisy. Nelson Mandela wasn't afraid of killing people in the pursuit of perceived justice. Neither, it seems, was Arnold Schwarzenegger.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe

Ah, the greater good! It's always good to kill people if it's for the greater good.

So can you identify no situation in which killing someone is appropriate?

If you're asking if I think the death penalty is appropriate for a system of criminal justice, then no. I do not think there is ever a situation where that is appropriate. It is immoral.

There are other situations where I think using deadly force is justified. Defending a country under military attack is one of these situations.

The reason I posted that is that I don't think belief in the greater good is enough. Believing in the greater good brought us the holocaust, for example. It is simply not enough of a reason to kill people.

> Believing in the greater good brought us the holocaust, for example.

Please do more historical research. The Holocaust was not caused by seeking the greater good, but instead the greater evil. It was caused when massive numbers of people decided that rule by terror was not worth resisting as long as it did not touch them.

I do not agree with the death penalty either, but your logic seems flawed to me. I don't have to share ALL the morals/ethics/worldviews that my heroes have.

Now if he came out against death penalty at some point and then reversed his stance, your accusation of hypocrisy would be accurate.

Edit: I was wrong about what hypocrisy meant - please see humanrebar's reply below.

> Now if he came out against death penalty at some point and then reversed his stance, your accusation of hypocrisy would be accurate.

No, changing your mind isn't hypocrisy. Hypocrisy is saying the rules don't apply to you somehow. If he executed someone with no trial and said it didn't count because it was somehow for the greater good, he would be a hypocrite.

If we don't leave people room to change their minds, we don't leave them room to grow. I'd rather be in a world where people learn lessons.

I stand corrected.

Well, executing a human being shrinks "the room for improvement". Permanently.

Yep. That's why they have due process and fair trials in California. At least according to the CA and US high courts. Some people say that any execution is immoral, and there's a good argument there as well.

A trial that could lead to a death penalty can never be "fair" because this kind of punishment leaves no room for re-socialization of the convict. There are certain rights that no punishment could ever take away from a human being. At least we have them here, in the EU.

Would that not be changing his mind about something, rather than hypocrisy, which is saying one thing but doing another.

Agreed, humanrebar explained it well!

Come on man, the whole piece is about having humility.

The Wikipedia article says this guy was one of the leaders of the Westside Crips; I don't feel sorry for him and can see why he wasn't granted clemency. I don't agree with the death penalty but it doesn't invalidate the sentiment in the article.

I don't know the details of the case, but I do know that politicians have to make a lot of difficult decisions based on more than their own personal opinions.

You need to read on Mandela's :)

People are flawed - it's OK to admire certain qualities and scoff at other idiotic opinions they have.

What's Austria got to do with it? Beethoven was Austrian, too.

Beethoven was German.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwig_van_Beethoven

Whoops, so he was; he died in Vienna but wasn't born there. What I get for commenting before coffee; thanks for the catch.

Probably Mozart was meant.