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Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by rconti on Monday April 04, 2016 @03:38PM (#11424783)
I know almost nothing about the inner workings of Google or the Nest team, and yet I regularly hear about Tony and what a piece of work he is.

If someone like myself, only casually acquainted with the organization, hears so many bad things about Tony, how does he still have a job? Forget his apparent management incompetence, at this point it's just bad PR for Google.

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by nostrademons on Monday April 04, 2016 @08:50PM (#11426990)
Larry tends to be very loyal to his lieutenants. I'd say this is a combination of 1.) his personality type 2.) that you have to be, in order to get people to work for you when it's clear that you aren't going to step aside any time soon and 3.) his long-term orientation, where he's willing to endure a lot of temporary hiccups with the faith that people will eventually get the job done.

All of these are positive character traits, but they also mean that some...well...sociopathic individuals have managed to gain his trust and hold it for long periods of time, doing significant damage to the organization in the process. In the past, he has eventually fixed things, it just took years.

It's hard to say that this is wrong, per se, since the alternative is often a slash-and-burn CEO that axes executives at the first sign of trouble in their divisions. You can't do anything long-term under those conditions either.

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by erikpukinskis on Monday April 04, 2016 @09:43PM (#11427194)
What do you mean about his personality type?
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by nostrademons on Monday April 04, 2016 @09:57PM (#11427254)
I'm a fan of Meyers-Briggs, so through that lens, I'd peg Larry as an INTJ, and INTJs tend to be very loyal to people close to them at the expense of not getting close to very many people. Tertiary Fi and all that.

Through the non-MBTI lens, just that he tends to be long-term oriented, inwardly-focused, and prefers to invest in long-term relationships with a few trusted people rather than gregariously flirt with many. He wanted all of his executives to pledge to commit to Google for 10 years when he became CEO in 2011 (ironically, most of them have left by now).

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by antiviral on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:36PM (#11426655)
>how does he still have a job

Certain people are gifted with the ability to "kiss up and kick down" their team, i.e., kiss up to those they need to impress, and for anyone else that is less valuable, "kick them" or treat them with less regard.

Here is a good Wikipedia article, with several case studies: John Bolton, Robert McNamara. Maybe someone can add his name to this list:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiss_up_kick_down

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by anonexnester on Monday April 04, 2016 @11:32PM (#11427576)
This. Spot on. Not just for Tony, but for everyone who is admired at Nest. First-line managers (not all, only the ones that the company celebrates and adores) especially - making life difficult for poor individual contributors (micromanagement, zero positive feedback or encouragement, tons of critical feedback), all the while sucking up to the middle managers who think their lieutenants are the best thing since sliced bread.
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by XJOKOLAT on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:39PM (#11426669)
"Gifted"?
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by chris_wot on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:52PM (#11426727)
Yes, normally a "gift" that keeps giving, even after that person leaves the company entirely.
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by simoncion on Monday April 04, 2016 @04:12PM (#11425130)
> If someone like myself, only casually acquainted with the organization, hears so many bad things about Tony, how does he still have a job?

Vivek "Vic" Gundotra did serious damage to Google's corporate image and was seriously reviled within Google, yet he stuck around for years. It's possible that Google upper management thinks that Fadell might be able to pull off a bet-the-company move. Gundotra was tasked with the same thing.

Or, it's possible that Google was contractually obligated to keep Gundotra around for a period of time, and is under the same obligation with Fadell. shrug

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by jdmichal on Monday April 04, 2016 @05:33PM (#11425862)
> Or, it's possible that Google was contractually obligated to keep Gundotra around for a period of time, and is under the same obligation with Fadell.

I can't believe that they would have so much negotiating power that there's no way out for Google. Even if it's moving them to be the VP of janitor closets.

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by chris_wot on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:59PM (#11426761)
At this level, there are a few issues:

1. potential reputation and organisational damage that such a person can bring to an organisation without carefully managing the situation;

2. in a company as big as Google (and frankly, one that is doing as well as Google!) it may take quite a lot of time to truly uncover the damage that a person is doing to an organisation, especially if that person is on good terms with upper management;

3. At a high enough level of management in a big enough company, lawyers and professional negotiators can wangle some amazingly good terms into the manager's contract. This can make it exceptionally tricky to remove this person quickly, or even move them sideways (if you move someone sideways, then you change their authority on a variety of things, which almost certainly changes their job description and thus their contract. This goes double if you demote them, even for the same money).

I can't speak for anything going on at Google of course, but I guess I can speculate that it might have been a combination of all three of these things. Which is utter speculation, so feel free to duly assign it the value that you feel it is worth :-)

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by fludlight on Monday April 04, 2016 @03:58PM (#11424989)
> how does he still have a job

There is a lag between management incompetence and revenue.

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by Gustomaximus on Monday April 04, 2016 @06:53PM (#11426394)
Often these people are very personable when they want to be. They use this trait to manage up but only those below them, and without the power to make changes, see the real person. This is why and exectutive team needs to be themself spending time at the working level or have eyes/ears there.
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by chris_wot on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:53PM (#11426729)
That honestly sounds like psychopathic behaviour...
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by croon on Tuesday April 05, 2016 @04:59AM (#11428913)
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by yuhong on Monday April 04, 2016 @05:13PM (#11425718)
From https://daringfireball.net/misc/2016/03/the-information-tony... : "Mr. Duffy never got a reply from Mr. Page, but the representative eventually told Mr. Duffy that Mr. Page had considered the offer but declined"
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by ocdtrekkie on Monday April 04, 2016 @06:11PM (#11426164)
In fairness, asking the CEO of the company if they'll fire someone and let you replace someone two managerial steps above yourself is rarely if ever going to work. ;)
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by outside1234 on Monday April 04, 2016 @11:36PM (#11427596)
Its worth a shot. Especially when you already have your check for your stock for the company you sold. :)
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by ocdtrekkie on Monday April 04, 2016 @05:39PM (#11425915)
Sundar Pichai still has a job.
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by victorhooi on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:09PM (#11426500)
I'm curious about what you might have heard too. I have only met Sundar briefly, but I've seen him speak a lot. He honestly seems like one of the nicest guys I've met - and from what I've heard, most people seem to agree.
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by spoinkaroo on Monday April 04, 2016 @05:44PM (#11425957)
What have you heard about Pichai?
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by burtmacklin on Monday April 04, 2016 @06:23PM (#11426241)
Curious about this too... most "tech industry" news I've read of him is full of fawning admiration.
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by ocdtrekkie on Monday April 04, 2016 @06:37PM (#11426303)
Google is incredibly good at their "PR releases disguised as interviews". Google senior employee puff pieces are pretty amazing. While such interviews aren't "paid" persay, you only get such interviews (and the clicks/ad-views they bring) if you portray those people in a positive light.

Though if you scrape them for minor bits, you find some minor hints. For example, one of those fawning admiration posts about him, two years ago, mentioned that he killed the Android laptop project, because it was competing with his own project, Chromebooks.

I recently heard the 'tack Android apps onto Chrome OS' strategy described as a "trainwreck" by a Google employee, and that ship has now been righted: Android is working on multi-window views in Android 6.x, and it's looking like Android is once again looking at a single converged OS for multiple form factors.

Ubuntu and Windows, of course, have been working on this for a while. Had Pichai not interfered out of his own ego for his own pet project, Google would be leading this curve, not trailing behind. As another commenter said above, "There is a lag between management incompetence and revenue". But Android was leading this until Pichai got in the way.

Between a huge stumble like this, that the media barely even noticed, and the fact that under Pichai, Google has lost almost all consumer trust, I have a hard time believing Sundar doesn't deserve a large helping of the blame.

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by milesskorpen on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:16PM (#11426538)
This hardly seems like a huge stumble.
Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by ocdtrekkie on Monday April 04, 2016 @07:49PM (#11426715)
Depends how well converged OSes start to take the main stage. If Windows gets a lot of traction with it (more likely than Ubuntu, to be honest), it could be one of those things where Google being two years ahead of the game would've helped. I see what Microsoft is doing today, and thinking "THIS was why I was so excited about Android when 3.0/4.0/etc. came out."

And considering the stumbles the ad market, their primary business, is having, being a strong device platform provider, which they've already shown they can monetize (outside of ads, Android is probably their next most profitable space), is really key.

Re:Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old sma... by golergka on Tuesday April 05, 2016 @01:46AM (#11428125)
Two years ago? Strange, I worked with Android in PC form-factor 3 years ago and while I haven't been following it, I was sure they're everywhere already.