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Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by krapp on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:31PM (#10240132)
How would this benefit Volkswagen? The article says the device activates emissions control systems when it detects the car is being tested... so it's not as if they're saving money by emulating a system they're not manufacturing.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by munificent on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:42PM (#10240207)
Reducing emissions usually comes at the expense of worse power or fuel economy.

By only reducing emissions during testing, they can demonstrate better engine power and fuel efficiency while also claiming to meet the emissions requirements.

Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by gnoway on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:42PM (#10240201)
Don't the emissions systems affect performance? I have a 2012 Golf TDI and really like it, one of the advantages over one of the hybrids is that I get pretty great fuel economy for the kind of driving I do, but it doesn't feel like I'm driving a weed eater.

This really pisses me off. It doesn't surprise me I guess but it never occurred to me that a car manufacturer could get away with something like this for, apparently, 6 model years.

Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by JorgeGT on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:50PM (#10240256)
Yes, a common strategy is to inject more EGR (exhaust gas) into the fresh intake air. As EGR is already burned, it is inert, so it negatively affects the combustion, lowering the temperature. With lower combustion temperature you get less NOx... but less power for each amount of fuel, so your efficiency/performance is lower, and also non burned products (CO, C) increase. You then trap those with the Diesel Particulate Filter... it's a very complicated game with very small margins, that's the reason of so much cheating.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by thrownaway2424 on Friday September 18, 2015 @01:27PM (#10240577)
Since this EPA action is about NOx, it seems VW will need to lower combustion temperature, leading to higher soot and therefore more particulate filter cycles. That will also increase fuel consumption.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by zardo on Friday September 18, 2015 @02:52PM (#10241298)
In addition to the recall, and likely upcoming penalty, VW can now look forward to a class action suit regarding vehicle fuel economy.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by JorgeGT on Friday September 18, 2015 @01:40PM (#10240708)
Yep! And increased fuel consumption = increased CO2. Endless fun! x)
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by sokoloff on Friday September 18, 2015 @09:50PM (#10242998)
EGR on a diesel also terribly gunks up the intake manifold downstream of the EGR introduction point. For that reason (and the loss of power and efficiency), it's often defeated.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by JorgeGT on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:34PM (#10240147)
To pass the test with lower emissions. This means lower taxes in some countries, and good PR in every one. Edit: to expand this, consider that in order to reduce emissions like NOx, you often must sacrifice performance, so the customer will complain. When standarised tests were introduced, a crude counter strategy was to trade performance for lower emissions for X amount of minutes (the duration of the test). So customers noticed "hey, my engine works much better after 15 min!" :P
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by izacus on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:39PM (#10240175)
It's possible that the engine power / automatic transmission shift profile / maximum RPM / etc. is being manipulated to output less emissions at the cost of acceleration, top speed, ride comfort, etc.

The most fuel-efficient / eco ride is rather "boring" by the standards of car enthusiasts and reviewers and I guess the cars wouldn't be configured for that mode by default.

(Just a guess though.)

Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by tracker1 on Friday September 18, 2015 @01:08PM (#10240400)
Or, you just pay more for a car that has those performance characteristics both in taxes/registration fees and in fuel.

That said, cheating like this is really bad on a very large scale, and should probably face fines and maybe criminal charges, unfortunately discovery is likely to fall outside U.S. juristiction so it would be hard to prove enough to bring criminal charges against the appropriate managers and executives.

Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by jstanley on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:37PM (#10240157)
It probably ruins performance -- that's the usual tradeoff with emissions systems.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by BashiBazouk on Friday September 18, 2015 @01:31PM (#10240608)
Help sell cars. I have a TDI sportswagon and this will be the second performance hit. A couple years after purchase there was a recall to reduce the power a bit via software "upgrade". Seems fuel filters were occasionally failing at high acceleration or with people that used high acceleration a lot. The power drop was minor but noticeable. I suspected then and even more after this indecent that VW knew about the problem but wanted max power to help sell cars during the test drives.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by S_A_P on Friday September 18, 2015 @01:18PM (#10240502)
The VW/Audi 2.0t EA888 engine is capable of producing 100 more hp with a software update. These turbo/diesel/supercharged engines have a million parameters that they can modify to change driveability. I cant believe that they would do something like that to pass emissions testing though, that seems incredibly foolish. I would imagine that with diesel engines, economy and certain emissions are at odds with each other.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by zardo on Friday September 18, 2015 @03:07PM (#10241381)
They are, in particular the higher the in cylinder combustion temperature the higher the efficiency, and the higher the NOx production. This caused heavy diesels to get less efficient for a few years when NOx stringencies were tightened. Then they were tightened far enough to require catalytic reduction, and manufactures went back to high efficiency high NOx combustion and removed the NOx downstream.
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by arnoooooo on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:33PM (#10240142)
My guess is it uses some part that would need to be replaced (or replaced more often) if left in full use all the time ?
Re:Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over... by organsnyder on Friday September 18, 2015 @12:51PM (#10240268)
That could be—especially since automakers are required by the EPA to include emissions warranties of 8 years/80,000 miles.