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Re:Test drive of a petrol car by reitanqild on Monday May 04, 2015 @10:18AM (#9486240)
remember -around here(Norway, next to Sweden) taxes on gas and gas cars make Tesla prices look very reasonable.

A brand new Tesla is about half the price of a similar (>400hp) car I guess.

Re:Test drive of a petrol car by toomuchtodo on Monday May 04, 2015 @10:34AM (#9486341)
That's what happens when externalities are properly priced into vehicles using taxes. Nicely done Norway/Sweden.
Re:Test drive of a petrol car by maxerickson on Monday May 04, 2015 @10:48AM (#9486451)
That's a pretty huge assertion you are throwing in there.

I think there is a fair chance that some of the tax there is just a simple luxury tax, with accidental relief on the Tesla side (as opposed to a proper pricing of externalities).

Re:Test drive of a petrol car by toomuchtodo on Monday May 04, 2015 @10:53AM (#9486493)
The tax incentives in question the remove a fair portion of the tax penalty apply to all electric vehicles, not just Tesla. The "relief" for Tesla isn't accidental.

I would say you'd be correct if the benefits applied solely to Tesla vehicles, but not in this case.

Re:Test drive of a petrol car by maxerickson on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:25AM (#9486731)
My meaning was more that it depends on how well the laws captured the intent of the societies.

The nice subsidies on expensive electric vehicles may or may not leave a bad taste in the mouth of voters there (I haven't tried to figure out what public sentiment is).

Re:Test drive of a petrol car by toomuchtodo on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:33AM (#9486788)
> The nice subsidies on expensive electric vehicles may or may not leave a bad taste in the mouth of voters there (I haven't tried to figure out what public sentiment is)

I could not find the answer to this with some quick googling. I too would be interested in the answer.

Re:Test drive of a petrol car by smackfu on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:07AM (#9486592)
When you just set a bunch of taxes to zero for a few years, it's hard to argue that is "proper pricing."
Re:Test drive of a petrol car by toomuchtodo on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:23AM (#9486704)
If the externalities they're pricing in are oil consumption in the vehicle, and the vehicle doesn't burn oil, setting the taxes to zero is "proper pricing".
Re:Test drive of a petrol car by _delirium on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:39AM (#9486839)
That's not the only externality; another one is wear-and-tear on roads. In most countries, fuel taxes are used in part to pay for road and highway maintenance [1]. Certainly Norway's extensive, mountainous highway system is not free to build and maintain, and imo all road users should pay their share to fund it. You could have a direct per-km tax enforced via some kind of GPS unit, but that has privacy implications. Traditionally the fuel tax was a reasonable proxy, since vehicles used fuel in rough proportion to the amount of road traversed.

[1] In the U.S. the link is explicit: almost the entirety of the fuel tax is earmarked for highway construction and maintenance, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highway_Trust_Fund

Re:Test drive of a petrol car by toomuchtodo on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:42AM (#9486866)
The vast majority of road wear and tear is caused by trucks, not cars:

"Heavy trucks obviously cause more road damage than cars, but how much more? According to a GAO study, Excessive Truck Weight: An Expensive Burden We Can No Longer Afford, road damage from one 18-wheeler is equivalent to 9600 cars (p.23 of study, p.36 of PDF)."

http://archive.gao.gov/f0302/109884.pdf

http://facweb.knowlton.ohio-state.edu/pviton/courses2/crp776...

With regards to your point to taxes, remove the per-milage tax and charge a flat per-vehicle rate based on vehicle class, distributing the cost to trucks more than to passenger vehicles.

Re:Test drive of a petrol car by smackfu on Monday May 04, 2015 @12:36PM (#9487214)
Seems like that would only apply to highways. The average neighborhood road sees zero truck traffic, so 100% of the road wear is done by cars.
Re:Test drive of a petrol car by toomuchtodo on Monday May 04, 2015 @12:41PM (#9487257)
Which is why the average neighborhood road is overhauled far less frequently than highways.
Re:Test drive of a petrol car by hnnewguy on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:05AM (#9486576)
Costs aren't being added to the gas cars, which would make sense. Instead, normal people are subsidizing luxury cars. That's stupid.
Re:Test drive of a petrol car by toomuchtodo on Monday May 04, 2015 @11:22AM (#9486701)
The costs are added to all gas cars, and "normal people" are subsidizing all electric cars. The cars that are selling just happen to be the most expensive electric car.