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Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by RealGeek on Monday December 08, 2014 @10:12AM (#8716781)
> The other side of that an accusation or suspicion isn't a reasonable basis on which to ruin someone's employability.

Would you marry or co-found a company with someone who was charged with a crime like murder, rape, robbery or fraud; but was let go after serving 7 months in prison because of insufficient evidence which could not meet the standard of "beyond reasonable doubt".

Unfortunately, rape cases are very hard to convict (even in US) because police & prosecutors does not take rape investigations seriously.

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by mike_hearn on Monday December 08, 2014 @10:15AM (#8716802)
Unfortunately, rape cases are very hard to convict (even in US) because police & prosecutors does not take rape investigations seriously.

They are hard to convict because usually there are no witnesses and it turns into he said / she said. I see a lot of people wishing it were not so, but the legal system has severe punishments and thus a high bar for conviction (or that's how it's supposed to be).

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by anigbrowl on Monday December 08, 2014 @02:30PM (#8718507)
It's more complex than that. If we have words on the street, and I punch you and break your nose, you won't have any problems getting your complaint taken seriously. Nobody gets their nose broken for pleasure; even boxing clubs and so on have rules of conduct and activities are generally supervised to ensure conduct remains within those boundaries.

On the other hand, people have sex for pleasure a lot, and sexual activity is strongly linked to emotion, so if you come to the police with a tale of an unwelcome sexual encounter you have to answer all these extra questions about consent and secondary motive to get taken seriously. If a complainant doesn't show obvious signs of physical trauma indicating a violent struggle, then it can often be a problem to get the complaint of rape to be taken seriously and investigated urgently.

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by mercurial on Monday December 08, 2014 @03:56PM (#8719123)
My impression is that in many countries, police officers are inadequately trained and often do not treat rape and sexual assault as seriously as they deserve.
Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by furyg3 on Monday December 08, 2014 @10:57AM (#8717050)
I wouldn't want someone to either not marry me or not be my co-founder because of unproven gossip, rumor, allegations, or charges.
Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by JoeAltmaier on Monday December 08, 2014 @10:59AM (#8717063)
I'm sure. But as the potential partner of such a person, wouldn't it be wise to give a pass to someone with a blot on their record? Especially if there is no lack of candidates for the position or partner? Clearly that would improve their odds of finding an acceptable mate.
Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by tomp on Monday December 08, 2014 @11:03AM (#8717089)
This sounds similar to the argument that you should avoid black people because they are more likely to be criminals; clearly that would improve your odds of finding an acceptable mate.

Conclusions: individuals are not odds.

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by JoeAltmaier on Monday December 08, 2014 @11:08AM (#8717127)
In a purely mathematical sense, its advantageous to dismiss candidates with any defect or suspected defect. At least when there is an endless supply.

The trouble with discrimination is, it works so well.

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by tomp on Monday December 08, 2014 @11:19AM (#8717191)
> its advantageous to dismiss candidates with any defect or suspected defect

I agree; the problem is just that the society (and laws) judges different cases of discrimination completely differently, even though the underlying mathematical principles are the same. Don't hire a man because he could be a rapist? OK. Don't hire a woman because she might give birth? Outrageous.

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by coldtea on Monday December 08, 2014 @11:32AM (#8717285)
@tomp

>even though the underlying mathematical principles are the same. Don't hire a man because he could be a rapist? OK. Don't hire a woman because she might give birth? Outrageous.

Yeah, one is not hiring someone who forces and hurts people for his sexual pleasure, the other is not hiring someone giving birth, something we celebrate, and helps human society continue existing.

I don't even know what "the underlying mathematical principles are the same" is supposed to mean, when the ethical differences are so vast. That there might be same chance of him being a rapist to her giving birth? How is that even relevant?

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by JoeAltmaier on Monday December 08, 2014 @11:42AM (#8717344)
Oh for goodness sake. The point was, as an employer or potential partner, you want someone who will be effective in that role. Whilst being distracted would be a negative, regardless of the reason for that distraction. Not a moral argument; a statistical one as stated - avoid anyone with any chance of distraction is a valid game-theory strategy.
Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by coldtea on Monday December 08, 2014 @01:26PM (#8718070)
>Oh for goodness sake. The point was, as an employer or potential partner, you want someone who will be effective in that role.

That's how I understood it too.

I was pointing to the inhumanity of treating people as mere means to an end ("not effective") especially in the case of pregnant women (which translates to women should either not get pregnant because its bad for business or be unemployable when they consider to do so).

You say it's just a "statistical argument". That's what I responded to, too: that's it's not OK - at least to me - to do mere statistical arguments when moral judgements are involved. Or rather, it's ok to do them as science, but this is not that, this is how actual managers and employers think and treat employees.

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by anigbrowl on Monday December 08, 2014 @02:37PM (#8718562)
An overly narrow view. A predictably potential rapist who was subsequently convicted would become permanently unavailable and and could bring down a huge liability on an employer. An employee who gives birth (or who becomes a father) is engaging in normal human activity; you treat that the same way you treat any other indisposition like an unexpected health condition, and hedge against it.

Really, ask yourself how you'd feel if a prospective employer or business partner said 'Joe, what assurance can you give me that you're not going to knock your wife up and go all googly-eyed over some squalling infant a year from now? Can you commit to tying a knot in it?'

Re:Uber banned from operating in Indian capital after rape a... by JoeAltmaier on Tuesday December 09, 2014 @08:28AM (#8722548)
Statistically, there are equally-qualified candidates with none of these problems. A moral-free algorithm would surely choose young unmarried technologists over any other kind. I'll repeat: the trouble with discrimination is, it works so well.