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Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by themartorana on Thursday November 13, 2014 @08:49PM (#8605405)
What happens if someone went on CNN/whatever and just went "so we got this NSL..."

Guantanamo?

I'm a bit surprised someone hasn't simply opened their mouths. I applaud the EFF and everyone fighting this fight. Money is free speech but you can't talk about super-aggressive and highly-invasive (probably unconstitutional) NSLs even to say you got one.

So utterly bizarre and disheartening. Although maybe disenfranchisement is half of the point.

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by mkal_tsr on Thursday November 13, 2014 @09:09PM (#8605468)
The EFF is doing important work. I hope everyone has either donated to them or switched their smile.amazon.com over to EFF. Or at least for the software/hardware people on HN.
Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by joshstrange on Friday November 14, 2014 @10:45AM (#8607632)
I didn't know you could do this (I thought there were only a few handpicked charities). If you want to make a similar change your smile charity go here:

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/charity/change.html?ie=UTF8&ref_...

Then install the "Smile Always" plugin to redirect you to smile:

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/smile-always/jgpmh... (The offical amazon one doesn't auto redirect AFAICT)

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by Karunamon on Thursday November 13, 2014 @09:23PM (#8605515)
Guantanamo, no. Ugly and protracted legal battle against an adversary that would like nothing better to make an example out of you, yes.
Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by toomuchtodo on Friday November 14, 2014 @12:48AM (#8605971)
"How do you feel about living in Russia for a bit?"
Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by Cieplak on Thursday November 13, 2014 @09:57PM (#8605604)
The court would likely charge you with contempt.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/02/19/child-services-fi...

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by higherpurpose on Friday November 14, 2014 @02:17AM (#8606161)
I'm still angry at Marissa Mayer for saying that if she could go to prison over something like this. That's just not something I would expect a CEO of such a major corporation to say. FFS, US is not China (yet). She shouldn't put fear into everyone's hearts with that kind of statement, especially since I believe it was mostly baseless.
Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by discardorama on Friday November 14, 2014 @11:05AM (#8607774)
Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by rayiner on Friday November 14, 2014 @08:30AM (#8606984)
A CEO can go to prison for selling stock at the wrong time...
Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by MagicWishMonkey on Thursday November 13, 2014 @09:38PM (#8605558)
You would likely go to federal prison, you would not be given a fair trial (a judge would sentence you in a secret court).

The only reason Ladar Levison (the Lavabit guy) is a free man right now is because the guardian picked up his story before the FBI could toss his ass in a black SUV. He got lucky.

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by rayiner on Thursday November 13, 2014 @10:05PM (#8605624)
Source on secret court is handing out jail sentences?

The whole "secret court" thing is FUD. The FISA "secret court" was created by law to insert itself into a process that didn't require a court proceeding in the first place. It's not empowered to adjudicate peoples' rights and obligations.

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by talmand on Friday November 14, 2014 @11:56AM (#8608119)
No source on handing out jail sentences, but I would bet you would get one if you defied it since you would be defying the law. Which would be when someone from the Justice Department would knock on your door. I would agree it's not quite the same thing.

As for "secret court" that you put in "scary" quotes. Just to be sure, no one says secret as in no one knows it exists, but that the public is not allowed to know what it does. Which is not FUD, some of us see that as a clear problem.

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by rayiner on Friday November 14, 2014 @12:29PM (#8608314)
It is definitely FUD to say "a judge would sentence you in a secret court."

And we know what the FISA court does--it reviews requests by intelligence agencies to engage in foreign surveillance, as provided for by the FISA Amendments Act. It does not put people in jail. The biggest misunderstanding about the FISA court, a misunderstanding rooted in FUD, is that it has the powers of an ordinary court and uses them in secret. But unlike a regular federal court, a FISA court cannot adjudicate your rights and obligations.

What Congress did by creating the FISA court was to insert the judicial branch into a process, foreign surveillance, that, Constitutionally, does not require judicial branch involvement. Its proceedings can be secret only because it does not exercise the normal power of the judicial branch to determine peoples' legal rights.

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by talmand on Monday November 17, 2014 @11:43AM (#8618974)
Ok, I'll try again. Yes, we know about the FISA courts. Yes, we know what they are mandated to do. Yes, we know they work with intelligence agencies.

The problem, as I see it, is the secret of exactly what they are doing in terms of American people and/or businesses that require they place gag orders on nearly everything they do.

I wouldn't say that they "sentence" people as in a normal court of law, but what happens if you defy one of their orders? If I were to ignore their gag orders then they'll just say "oh well, too bad for us"? The reason we don't know what happens in that case is because, as far as I know, no one has openly defied the orders.

Notice I said the Justice Department, not FISA, knocks on your door.

Saying this court throws people into secret prisons via secret orders enabled by secret laws is, of course, FUD. But then, I'm not saying any of that at all.

Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by jgeorge on Friday November 14, 2014 @09:57AM (#8607378)
I still don't think I'd like to be the person to test that.
Re:Unsealed Filing Shows DOJ Misled Appeals Court About NSL ... by kabdib on Friday November 14, 2014 @11:11AM (#8607813)
See? The system works!

/snark