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Re:Ten Thousand Years by Houshalter on Saturday July 26, 2014 @06:18PM (#8091020)
I actually read the paper this article is summarizing, and it's incredibly interesting. I can't find it anymore, but I did find this excerpt:

>The panel roughly defined the intended message with the following:

This place is a message... and part of a system of messages... pay attention to it!Sending this message was important to us. We considered ourselves to be a powerful culture.

This place is not a place of honor...no highly esteemed deed is commemorated here... nothing valued is here.

What is here is dangerous and repulsive to us. This message is a warning about danger.

The danger is in a particular location... it increases toward a center... the center of danger is here... of a particular size and shape, and below us.

The danger is still present, in your time, as it was in ours.

The danger is to the body, and it can kill.

The form of the danger is an emanation of energy.

The danger is unleashed only if you substantially disturb this place physically. This place is best shunned and left uninhabited.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by nl on Saturday July 26, 2014 @11:26PM (#8091862)
This is the full report: http://www.osti.gov/scitech/biblio/10117359

I read it some years ago, too. It's an intriguing task, as the comments in this thread show.

The considered the whole "people will think it is treasure" thing. From memory the solution was to make it an open but unpleasant place to try to avoid people thinking there was something hidden.

One idea that stuck in my mind was black concrete pillars on a black concrete surface, in a hot environment to make it extremely hot and oppressive for anyone to enter.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by Houshalter on Sunday July 27, 2014 @06:04AM (#8092373)
Concrete would get covered over in sand or dirt most likely. We also can't predict the climate 10k years in the future.
Re:Ten Thousand Years by Pirate-of-SV on Saturday July 26, 2014 @06:28PM (#8091051)
> ...no highly esteemed deed is commemorated here... nothing valued is here.

Sounds like a great place to hide a treasure.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by arrrg on Sunday July 27, 2014 @02:19PM (#8093484)
That’s why that is the message, not the actual implementation of the message …

This message was never supposed to be written anywhere, in any language. That message is the content. It’s the goal, it’s what is supposed to be delivered. It’s the payload and the panel came together to find a way to transport that payload across time.

The goal is not that someone in the future reads exactly that message, the goal is that someone in the future sees the markers and they convey (at least parts of) the message to them so that they honestly believe it.

As you can see, just describing the intended message right now, today, can be highly misleading and confusing, even when you are straightforward in describing it. People are quick in assuming fraud and deception, for example. That’s the challenge.

But no, no one wanted to put signs with that message up. That would not do. That was always clear. Even if people in 10,000 years would understand English.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by Balgair on Saturday July 26, 2014 @07:34PM (#8091270)
or a weapon. Just think of what a Genghis or Cesar would have done with such a thing, especially if he had no idea of what the long term effects were. I think labeling the stuff is too dangerous as well, politicians can get their hands on the stuff. It's better to just bury it, as safely as possible, and then remove all outside traces of existence.
Re:Ten Thousand Years by krisgee on Saturday July 26, 2014 @07:46PM (#8091312)
>It's better to just bury it, as safely as possible, and then remove all outside traces of existence.

Seems quite rude to leave unmarked radioactive waste lying around where future people might stumble over it.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by TeMPOraL on Saturday July 26, 2014 @10:32PM (#8091763)
I side with curtis here[0]. If you burry this stuff deep enough in sealed containers, using best tech available, then (barring any massive geological changes) the only way for someone to stumble over it is if they have technological capabilities comparable to ours.

[0] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8091034

Re:Ten Thousand Years by krisgee on Saturday July 26, 2014 @11:56PM (#8091911)
Yes and as a person in a culture with technology comparable to ours it seems like, miners for instance would be pretty ticked off if they were falling into old pits of unmarked radioactive waste all the time.
Re:Ten Thousand Years by anon4 on Sunday July 27, 2014 @08:45AM (#8092588)
They would send a few expendable soldiers and later on observe the effects of radiation sickness.

Then they would try using the stuff as a weapon and discover you can't clean up after throwing it at the enemy.

A couple of cities would become uninhabitable and everyone will learn that when the sign says "do not touch", we actually mean it.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by maaku on Saturday July 26, 2014 @10:59PM (#8091804)
Worked for Genghis Khan.
Re:Ten Thousand Years by cpeterso on Sunday July 27, 2014 @12:30PM (#8093179)
^ And if anyone knows about hiding treasure, it's someone with the handle "Pirate-of-SV". :)
Re:Ten Thousand Years by logicallee on Saturday July 26, 2014 @10:30PM (#8091759)
yeah you know what I would do if I read that? Open the damn tomb - I don't care about ancient superstitions.

instead of those statements, a few simple scientific demonstrations should be more than sufficient.

it should simply show large photographs of what happens with radiation exposure, as well as enough scientific equipment that even a simpleton can realize that this isn't some superstitious gobledegook.

seriously. what do you think the egyptians would have said about their tombs?

Best left undisturbed, right? Or Ra will come smite your ass.

Show, don't tell.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by TeMPOraL on Saturday July 26, 2014 @10:35PM (#8091771)
> it should simply show large photographs of what happens with radiation exposure, as well as enough scientific equipment that even a simpleton can realize that this isn't some superstitious gobledegook

Well, we don't know how to build required scientific equipment that will remain operational for more than few decades. Actually, the genetically-modified glowcats mentioned in the article is the closest thing I can imagine that could work over the timespan of many millenia.

Also, I don't see how future archaeologist would not assume anything they find is a "superstitious gobledegook" in need of verifying, if today we do exactly that.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by mikro2nd on Sunday July 27, 2014 @04:03AM (#8092248)
> the genetically-modified glowcats mentioned in the article is the closest thing I can imagine that could work

Except that the proponents seem to have forgotten the small fact of evolution. Species evolve. All the time.

Over the course of a 100 century timescale I would expect the glowcats to evolve into quite different species, possibly several such species, or perhaps going extinct. It's anybody's guess, really, and whether they would retain the colour-change genetics is at best nothing more than a rather long-shot hope. Or those genes might evolve to cause the organism respond to other stimuli than radiation.

The only certainty, here, is that such creatures will evolve into something different from what they start out as, so, almost certainly, defeating the original objective.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by Houshalter on Sunday July 27, 2014 @06:15AM (#8092395)
10k years isn't a huge amount of time for evolution. If the gene isn't detrimental it will definitely persist in the population that long. It takes a long time for DNA to completely degrade from accumulated random mutations. We still have genes from our prehuman ancestors that are mostly intact.
Re:Ten Thousand Years by Houshalter on Sunday July 27, 2014 @06:14AM (#8092390)
The tomb of the first Chinese emperor has not been opened because they are concerned it's filled with mercury gas.

It's not "superstitious gobledegook", it's how you convey a message without using words only people from our culture and time period would know. Or indeed, without any words at all.

Photographs, diagrams, technological equipment, and everything else, were all proposed in the paper as methods of conveying that information. But there are serious issues with all of them. Very few things will last that long, especially in good shape. And symbols we understand in our culture will have no meaning to them. Even photographs can easily mislead, and as you said, encourage people to explore.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by dllthomas on Sunday July 27, 2014 @02:27PM (#8093504)
"The tomb of the first Chinese emperor has not been opened because they are concerned it's filled with mercury gas."

If that's really the only reason, it seems easy enough to circumvent.

Re:Ten Thousand Years by autokad on Saturday July 26, 2014 @11:17PM (#8091836)
is that like on the cover of justin beiber's albums or something?
Re:Ten Thousand Years by jtheory on Saturday July 26, 2014 @09:49PM (#8091661)
This is great -- I'm planning on burying most of my substantial fortune deep underground in the New Mexico desert, and this looks like just the thing to signpost around the site so people don't mess with it.