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Re:Firefox 27 Released by iagooar on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @11:25AM (#7178393)
Some time ago I was a Firefox user. Then Chrome came out and I first started using it for free-time browsing, while still developing on Firefox. Later, I decided to fully migrate to Chrome.

I've decided to change it again, so I'm going to give Firefox a try during this month. For now, it looks really nice, performance seems to be quite good and the feeling of getting at least a small part of my digital life away from Google feels nice as well.

Tomorrow I'll be trying out the Firefox' developer tools.

I'd be really happy if Firefox convinced me to stay, as I really love what Mozilla is doing for the web community.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by davexunit on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @01:36PM (#7179361)
>I'd be really happy if Firefox convinced me to stay, as I really love what Mozilla is doing for the web community.

If you love what they are doing then I urge you to stick with Firefox in the future. Firefox is the only major browser that is free software. Chrome is proprietary and sends a lot of your data to Google. Google entices a lot of programmers with their developer tools, but it's not worth trading freedom for.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by sethish on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @03:44PM (#7180122)
Chromium, the open-source-only version of Chrome is also a viable option.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by devcpp on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @04:26PM (#7180346)
Well, davexunit did say "Firefox is the only major browser that is free software". Chromium is arguably a very minor browser.

Besides, if you would like take a tiny amount of market share from Google (thereby weakening their ability to set standards such as the W3C's "EME" DRM, which they support), you know that using Firefox is the right thing to do.

It also shows Google that you're not buying into their free/nonfree paradigm that discourages developers from making apps/extensions not approved by Google's stores.

Also, Chromium OS, as distributed by Google, is not free of surveillance mechanisms such as the omnibar. You'd first have to audit, hunt and remove these features, or trust a third party to do this job for you.

Besides, in my experience, there are fewer good FOSS extensions in Chromium, in particular anti-surveillance ones, but that depends on what extensions you want.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by keeperofdakeys on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @05:45PM (#7180769)
Chromium isn't a "minor brower", it is Chrome. Nearly all the code that does any real work is developed as part of Chromium, google just throw a few patches on top to make Chrome.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by ndesaulniers on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @09:52PM (#7181621)
Can you checkout the code, apply their patches, and build Chrome? Can you do that with Firefox? ;)
Re:Firefox 27 Released by davexunit on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @01:03PM (#7185460)
Chromium is mostly free software, but it's sketchy enough territory that afaik no fully free GNU/Linux distribution packages it.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by sethish on Thursday February 13, 2014 @02:15PM (#7233525)
Chromium is packaged in Ubuntu and Debian. It's not packaged in Fedora because Chromium forked a half-dozen libraries [instead of pushing changes upstream](http://ostatic.com/blog/making-projects-easier-to-package-wh...). Of course, none of these are 'fully free' distros.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by rubiquity on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @11:38AM (#7178491)
I think you'll be quite impressed with Firefox's developer tools again. I've been more and more unhappy with Chrome's tools, mostly the subtle changes of not having filters and things so readily available anymore. The Firefox tools are quite slick though. I don't even use Firebug anymore.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by cbaleanu on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:52PM (#7179049)
So glad I am not the only one noticing the filter change. That additional click to display the filtering options that Chrome introduced really made me start using FF more and more for work.

I think this dumbing-down approach Google is doing with all their apps and websites will only alienate more and more professionals out of using their platform.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by paulirish on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @02:03PM (#7179551)
(Chrome DevTools team here). We cleaned up the filtering as it was totally inconsistent across all panels. So now it introduces one more click, but felt like generally that extra click was OK. I think we can still improve the UX, however. Which panels do you most use filters on (and for what?) Console, Network?
Re:Firefox 27 Released by rubiquity on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @02:08PM (#7179588)
Network is definitely the one I always click to turn the filters on.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by dflt on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @05:09AM (#7182877)
Hey Paul, I'm trapped on Chromium-30.0.1599.101 (same goes for similar Chrome version) because DevTools freeze for ~3 minutes after GWT's SuperDevMode recompilation on newer Chrome/Chromium. There is huge regression in performance after Chromium 32.x.xxxx.xxx. Chromium-30.0.1599.101 is the latest version without this problem on my distro.

I've tried to report this but you guys don't have proper bug tracker only form in the about menu.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by paulirish on Wednesday February 12, 2014 @06:17PM (#7228132)
http://crbug.com/ is the place to file tickets for us. File something and we can take a look!
Re:Firefox 27 Released by jackocnr on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @06:52PM (#7181044)
99% of the time I just want XHR, so this change added an extra click every time I open dev tools to look at the Network panel (also this step can be laggy if you're in development and you have hundreds of separate requests for your scripts/stylesheets, which I never care about). So I could actually be in favour of hiding away the filters if I could just set a default filter? Or if it just remembered my last selection?
Re:Firefox 27 Released by cbaleanu on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @02:39PM (#7179780)
Network most definitely, for checking requests. Using filtering there is very useful as it allows me to quickly toggle between All and Scripts / XHR.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by MrBra on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @12:36AM (#7182091)
I knew they were attently watching on this thread... :)
Re:Firefox 27 Released by sorenbs on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @02:41PM (#7179790)
Network for sure
Re:Firefox 27 Released by skrowl on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:03PM (#7178657)
If you install both, you can use both side by side. F12 for firebug, Ctrl Shift K for built in.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by lingben on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:06PM (#7178681)
Right now firefox beats the pants off chrome for memory usage - that is why I'm using it.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by clarry on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:19PM (#7178784)
Still it can't deal with memory pressure, and will just eventually oom & crash.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by bad_user on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:48PM (#7179021)
The problems I've been having in Firefox are with badly behaved apps - with memory leaks and stuff. Firefox manages memory better than Chrome, but when a tab leaks it can freeze the whole browser. Still, this happens rarely enough that it isn't an issue for me, plus Firefox is much better at keeping many tabs open. I did disable Flash and now I have to "click to play" - but I'm doing the same thing in Chrome too, because fuck Flash.

I feel like Chrome is better when rendering stuff - like we've got this plotted graph in our app's admin, rendered with Javascript and I believe HTML5 Canvas or something, with too many points on it and Firefox can't handle the rendering, it chokes, whereas Chrome can do it. On the other hand, I feel like Firefox is snappier in general.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by ndesaulniers on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @09:27PM (#7181544)
> tab leaks it can freeze the whole browser

Process per tab is _almost_ ready: http://billmccloskey.wordpress.com/2013/12/05/multiprocess-f...

You can play with it by setting `browser.tabs.remote` to true in about:config.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by ZoFreX on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @05:58AM (#7183043)
I don't even want process per tab, I'd be happy with something much simpler: Tell me which tab is causing Firefox to use 100% CPU! This happens fairly frequently with lots of tabs open (I guess I use a lot of websites with really bad javascript) and the only recourse is to either quit Firefox entirely and re-open it, or play a guessing game.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by ndesaulniers on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @05:46PM (#7187416)
Firefox will stop any client side JavaScript after 5-6s and ask whether you want to keep running the slow running script or not. If will even change to that tab before prompting you. Isn't that what you just described?
Re:Firefox 27 Released by ZoFreX on Thursday February 06, 2014 @10:56AM (#7190955)
Only if it totally locks up the browser though, not if the browser remains responsive but eats a lot of cycles.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by ndesaulniers on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:30PM (#7178879)
What's your host environment and browsing habits like (lots of tabs open, many pinned tabs, lots of video, flash video)?
Re:Firefox 27 Released by clarry on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @01:08PM (#7179158)
Having just one gigabyte of physical RAM, I run Firefox with a 512M rlimit (the OpenBSD default), as I have to reserve some space for other software too (and swap is painfully slow on the spinning disk).

As far as browsing habits go, I do usually have quite a few tabs open (currently I've got 38, though they're not all loaded; I don't think I often go much over this often). None are pinned. Video is disabled, and I've got no flash or plugins.

I've got three extensions (noscript, https-everywhere, duckduckgo plus). I tend to run with scripts disabled and this helps a lot with memory pressure. Sometimes I make the mistake of thinking I need to enable javascript for something (hi Google), and that's usually when memory usage skyrockets and the thing dumps core :-) But eventually it'll happen even if I don't allow any scripts.

Re:Firefox 27 Released by ndesaulniers on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @09:46PM (#7181600)
This is getting close to the limit of my expertise. What resource is bumping into it's system limit? Can you back up that answer with a stack trace or core dump? If so, would you mind filing a bug in our bug tracker? [0] It looks like if you put [MemShrink] in the Whiteboard field, the memshrink team should pick it up. If not, you could jump in #memshrink in our IRC server, irc.mozilla.org, and let someone there know. [1]

You can ping me directly on irc, too. My handle is a literal new line character (which _is_ a valid nick), and I'd be happy to help you get the bug filed if you run into any issues. Once you have a bugzilla account, you'll see it's generally pretty easy to submit bugs and provide feedback in channels that allow us to more easily find and work on issues. We're happy to help, too!

I'd file the issue myself, but I'd prefer to enable you to see how easy it is, and for you to provide the stack trace. Even providing steps to reproduce issues makes you a part of our Mozilla community. Welcome!

[0] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/ [1] https://wiki.mozilla.org/Performance/MemShrink

Re:Firefox 27 Released by slyall on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @03:33PM (#7180069)
Re:Firefox 27 Released by nnethercote on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @03:35AM (#7182593)
512 MiB rlimit and you usually have 10s of tabs open? I'm not surprised you're having problems; that's a pretty unusual and challenging configuration. Do other browsers behave any better?
Re:Firefox 27 Released by jobigoud on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:54PM (#7179067)
You are talking about Chrome right ? We have a memory intensive app which works perfectly on FF26 (and IE11), and crashes the tab on Chrome 32 with memory hitting 3GB+ and up. Their garbage collector must be leaking like crazy. (Works in Chrome 22).
Re:Firefox 27 Released by cpeterso on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @12:25PM (#7178835)
Firefox's new Australus UI will be merged to the Aurora channel in just a couple days, if you'd like to try it out (without installing the bleeding edge Nightly channel).
Re:Firefox 27 Released by dorkrawk on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @01:07PM (#7179154)
I love the new Australus UI. I've been playing around on Nightly for a bit and I can't wait until that gets rolled into the main branch.
Re:Firefox 27 Released by acqq on Tuesday February 04, 2014 @04:00PM (#7180228)
It looks very bad to me, doing everything against the UI conventions of the OS. The menu gone from the top right, why oh why? Didn't Firefox success started with being more "native" (close to the OS UI) than the predecessor? The history of bad decisions seems to repeat with every new generation?

Mozilla guys, you really want to annoy your users again? Why?

Re:Firefox 27 Released by elclanrs on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @08:16PM (#7188077)
Australis looks nice in Ubuntu. The new menu is much better with big icons and can be customized however you like it. It's great IMO. I took a couple screenshots from latest nightly release. http://i.imgur.com/19Iwy7r.png, http://i.imgur.com/6Kouk14.png
Re:Firefox 27 Released by nnethercote on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @03:31AM (#7182576)
If you have an old Firefox profile hanging around, please reset it first: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/reset-firefox-easily-fi...
Re:Firefox 27 Released by keehun on Wednesday February 05, 2014 @09:31AM (#7183877)
Firefox just simply never lives up to the experience I get from Chrome or Chromium. It crashes very often on certain pages (harmless and trustworthy pages from sites that shouldn't be causing crashes) and extensions like 1Password just don't work properly all the time and scrolling/performance is never as good as Chrome. I always give it a third/fourth/fifth chance but can't stand Firefox for more than five minutes.