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A comment on Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference before death (2012). Parent comment

Re:Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference ... by junto on Monday September 30, 2013 @10:29AM (#6469783)
I disagree. Making the victim look like some kind of pervert or loner would appear to be common occurrence for British citizens.

Of course, all Brits might all be perverted loners!

  Nicholas Anderson, former MI6 officer turned author, told
  The Independent on Sunday: "I am on verbal record to my 
  own family, close friends and select lawyers that if 
  anything ever happened to me – a straight man and a 
  positive thinker – it would likely be made to look either 
  like a suicide or that I died dressed like a woman.

  "Over the years, it seems to me a favourite way of 
  presentation. I, of course, am not suicidal in any remote 
  way nor do I like to dress so. When I read in the press 
  about Gareth Williams, women's clothes, and a wig, it all 
  fits the usual scenario."
N.B. The source of the above quote is not currently available: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/curious-case-of-a...

Other suspicious UK deaths:

- http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mi6-dirty-secrets-why-d...:

- In 1983, 25-year-old Stephen Drinkwater, who worked as a clerk at GCHQ, was found dead at his home with a plastic bag over his head.

- In 1997 another worker, Nicholas Husband, 46, was found dead at home dressed in a bra and panties – with a plastic bag over his head.

- Two years later, Kevin Allen, 31, a language expert at GCHQ, was found dead in his bed at home with a plastic bag over his head and a dust mask over his mouth.

And a few more British perverts and loners:

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Milligan

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Gareth_Williams

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Mossman

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Moyle

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Rusbridger

Plus a couple of other deaths that were linked to the state:

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilda_Murrell

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Kelly

- Dr. Richard Holmes (Dr. David Kelly's co-worker) - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2133201/Dr-Richard-H...

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_MacRae

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Mannakee

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lindi_St_Clair

Apologies about the "source" but: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2139799/Sex-spies-se...

In summary, many of these deaths were suspicious. None of them have been proved to be attributed to the British security services, but is interesting that the link (however tenuous) is there.

Look at it another way. If you are the security services and you need to get rid of someone, making a murder look like a suicide is a good move. However, a suicide normally requires depression or some linked emotional trauma. Without that, the suicide is suspicious. If the suicide is linked to an accidental sexual game then the victim looks like a pervert, is shamed publicly and the "suicide" is much difficult to question. QED, murders through sexual misadventures are much easier to pass off than depressive suicides or straight up murders.

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Re:Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference ... by teamgb on Monday September 30, 2013 @11:34AM (#6470133)
Yes, the Daily Mail loves a bit of faux outrage and tabloid gossip, but they actually do employ journalists (sometimes). Here they cover expert evidence given to the coroner. Check out the pictures and videos.

>An escapology expert tried and failed 300 times to lock himself into an identical bag after being hired to try to crack the mystery of Gareth Williams' death.

...

He said: 'I just cannot do it. This case, I just cannot get it off my mind. It is very difficult. I am an escapologist, I am thinking outside the box here and trying everything I can to find a way.'

Dr Wilcox added: 'With all your trials and failures do you think it would be impossible to padlock this bag from the inside?'

Mr Faulding replied: 'I cannot say it was impossible, but even Houdini would struggle.'

He said Mr Williams could not have survived for more than 30 minutes as the temperature quickly rose and oxygen levels dropped. Mr Faulding said he only lasted five minutes before becoming 'delirious' after zipping himself inside with emergency oxygen and a paramedic outside.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2136118/Gareth-Willi...

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Re:Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference ... by logicallee on Monday September 30, 2013 @12:34PM (#6470512)
I had to laugh for about a solid minute at,

>I am an escapologist, I am thinking outside the box here.

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Re:Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference ... by DanBC on Monday September 30, 2013 @01:15PM (#6470824)
> Look at it another way. If you are the security services and you need to get rid of someone, making a murder look like a suicide is a good move. However, a suicide normally requires depression or some linked emotional trauma. Without that, the suicide is suspicious. If the suicide is linked to an accidental sexual game then the victim looks like a pervert, is shamed publicly and the "suicide" is much difficult to question. QED, murders through sexual misadventures are much easier to pass off than depressive suicides or straight up murders

Or, you know, people do just kill themselves in large numbers in the UK. Men aged between 15 and 44 have the highest rates of completed suicide. While GCHQ is an Equal Opportunities employer it's likely that they employ many men because of the electronic and computing work.

(http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/subnational-health4/suicides-i...)

Mental health services in Gloucestershire are provided by 2gether NHS Foundation Trust. But there have been changes over this time - the 3 primary care trusts merged into a single trust; money from the budget of 2gether was taken to bail out one of the financially failing trusts; IAPT and PCAT have started; 2gether have done a lot of work to improve times for specialist community based psychotherapy (the wait used to be well over two years, it's much quicker now but they're still working on it). Suicide prevention hasn't been a national priority for very long.

> In summary, many of these deaths were suspicious

Really? Why? People die depressingly often by suicide. There is a known mechanism of "contagion" with DSH and suicide, and so we expect to find clusters of suicides.

I'd suggest the Marconi suicides (which used a number of bizarre methods) are much more suspicious than a death including suffocation. (Bags are sometimes used to preserve "dignity"; or to prevent need for cleanup of vomit.)

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Re:Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference ... by teamgb on Monday September 30, 2013 @11:39AM (#6470157)
Wayback Machine is your friend, regarding the quote/article above:

http://web.archive.org/web/20121022174605/http://www.indepen...

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Re:Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference ... by gadders on Monday September 30, 2013 @11:07AM (#6469992)
Michael Hutchence died like this as well. Perhaps we should investigate his links to MI6.
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Re:Codebreaker found in bag attended US security conference ... by junto on Monday September 30, 2013 @11:24AM (#6470087)
Of course I agree that there is the possibility that autoerotic-asphyxiation is an art that is enjoyed by many more than most of us appreciate! Sometimes it goes wrong.

However, there just seems to be worrying number of people who are linked to the British security services.

Other notable names (non-security services related) include:

- David Carradine: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Carradine

- Kristian Digby: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kristian_Digby

- Kevin Glibert: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Gilbert

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