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Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by ISL on Sunday September 29, 2013 @02:31AM (#6464332)
... has not yet delivered things like... Github

http://gitlab.org/

Open source software alone can't spin up hardware. It makes sense to pay someone for providing a physical service.

Github is getting paid already for developing what will someday influence a definitive open-source interface to git and collaboration.

Photoshop is really nice software. The GIMP is too, and perpetually improving. Closed-source programs are sometimes the vanguard to show the world that a particular idea is important and useful. Any sufficiently useful closed-source program will be cloned into open source in today's environment.

15-20 years ago, the world had a plethora of closed-source options for a gui-based OS. These days, open-source offerings compete on near-equal footing.

It's almost as easy as typing:

apt-get install debian

on any keyboard anywhere to get access to a functional GNU/Linux system. A lot of closed-source programmers earned a lot of money showing us what features of that system have mass appeal.

Is a government-funded public cloud not beholden to the government which funds it?

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by frozenport on Sunday September 29, 2013 @03:24AM (#6464421)
I think you are overly optimistic, LibreOffice remains less functional than Office 97 and GIMP is a study in bad GUI design - not to mention the rest of the Creative Suite being missing in action. I was recently shocked to learn that I can't rotate text inside a table. Also LibreOffice at one point included the full source code of Thunderbird, some OSS is well written but I am not convinced that it is better at the architecture level when compared to Microsoft's offerings.

After 15-20 years the OpenSource user-land remains confusingly fragmented. Multiple monitors are a pain and applications don't have the understanding of full-screen. Working with icons on the desktops was hard, so now we have launchers, and now we are doing away with the desktop all together - my theory being that drag-able icon interaction was too hard to implement. Distro's are fragmented by their philosophies on software rather then their GUI's - resulting in horrible user experiences. Why the hell does Linux mint come in so many flavors?

Drivers remain a problem, I recently had to recompile modify the kernel because my elan mouse was being detected incorrectly. Ubuntu has made large leaps but I have noticed that their GUI burns power and shutters on systems that are about 5 years old. Also, remember when computers could hibernate?

But, I use Gentoo for work, 'cause kcachegrind is good. I think OSS has delivered something unique to its users but it is whole different from a general purpose operating system like Windows.

I think the comparison between Latex and Word is a good comparison between he OpenSource and propriety world.

When people speak to highlight the progress of OSS I am tempted to ask:

How many years do I have to wait?

How many years do I have to wait?

How many years do I have to wait?

How many years do I have to wait?

How many years do I have to wait?

How many years do I have to wait?

How many years do I have to wait?

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by clarry on Sunday September 29, 2013 @04:09AM (#6464506)
> GIMP is a study in bad GUI design

Whenever I've asked people to provide concrete examples of this, their issue has been that they expect the UI to be a 1:1 clone of whatever application they're used to (usually Photoshop) and so they don't know how to do some things, or can't operate smoothly enough as they haven't taken the time to grow muscle memory comparable to what they have with Photoshop.

I'm not a big fan of GIMP, but I want to scream of frustration on the occassion that I have to work with Photoshop (which I don't know well at all).

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by frozenport on Sunday September 29, 2013 @04:34AM (#6464544)
I don't like the ideas of floating control panels everywhere. They tend to distract, I find myself constantly needing to open and close them and they also occupy a lot of space. The issue has existed for dozens of years, finally the folks at GIMP appear to have sobered up and are working on a single-window mode http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.8.html
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by clarry on Sunday September 29, 2013 @04:55AM (#6464582)
Yes, the SDI vs. MDI debate has been a popular and flamy one. It's also a rather subjective issue, and preference depends on what you're used to, what window manager you run (and how you're using it's features), etc. GIMP used to get bashed a lot for this UI choice, but the haters often forget that Photoshop (originally Mac software) defaults (or at least used to, and I believe it still does?) to SDI in the Apple land.

I'm glad that those who want MDI have finally stepped up and implemented it. Recently I've been using a tiling window manager that doesn't deal particularly well with floating windows. Now I have the choice.

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by dllthomas on Sunday September 29, 2013 @09:56AM (#6465185)
"what window manager you run (and how you're using it's features)"

Right, exactly. I've found that starting GIMP in ratpoison is a little glitchy - two windows spend time competing for a single frame until I pull one of them into another frame - but once I've done that I quite like the experience of using GIMP in ratpoison.

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by hrjet on Monday September 30, 2013 @10:42AM (#6469858)
In the context of this discussion, GIMP wins. You (or a group of users) are "free" to create an alternative interface for GIMP. The rest of the features of GIMP are readily available to be integrated.

The GP on the other hand is forced to use the exact same interface that Adobe prescribes for Photoshop. Moreover, if Adobe shuts down tomorrow, it is the end of the road for Photoshop development.

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by johnsonman on Sunday September 29, 2013 @09:20PM (#6467301)
One that I've hit recently is that an open colour picker window prevents quit from doing anything. It also doesn't show the colour picker window, so I don't know why GIMP isn't quitting, just that pressing a common key combination (cmd+q) doesn't work for no good reason (colour picking is not an operation that needs to block quitting).
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by phaemon on Sunday September 29, 2013 @04:00AM (#6464489)
What an appalling Gish gallop. Well, as usual, the only thing to do is point out the first wrong thing. Conveniently, everything you said was wrong, so I can just pick the first clear statement you made: you can rotate text within a table.
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by frozenport on Sunday September 29, 2013 @04:25AM (#6464536)
http://ask.libreoffice.org/en/question/3990/how-to-rotate-in...

also

https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=48804

--edit, not sure why links to the bugzilla describing the issue are giving me downvotes...

--edit 2 : I actually hit this bug when making a flyer, the bottom had little flaps with our groups email. It broke PowerPoint compatibility, and I had to reboot into Windows.

--edit 3: You made laugh when you mentioned that "You can't invert the text quite so easily, you have to draw a rectangle with text in which can then be rotated any arbitrary degree." That sums up whats wrong with many user side facing programs. Too bad LibreOffice doesn't support pipes :-)

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by phaemon on Sunday September 29, 2013 @04:40AM (#6464556)
Probably because both those links specifically say you can rotate text 90 and 270 degrees. You can't invert the text quite so easily, you have to draw a rectangle with text in which can then be rotated any arbitrary degree.

Next time you trawl bug reports looking for anti-Linux material, try reading them more carefully.

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by clarry on Sunday September 29, 2013 @05:06AM (#6464604)
Did you just equate Linux with OSS?
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by phaemon on Sunday September 29, 2013 @05:32AM (#6464658)
No.
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by webreac on Sunday September 29, 2013 @07:58AM (#6464923)
"I can't rotate text inside a table". My memory is perhaps wrong, but I thought it was possible earlier in openoffice than in word. For information, in the menu "Paragraph style", you have a tab "Position" where you can select the "Rotation / scaling" "90 degrees".
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by wslh on Sunday September 29, 2013 @01:01PM (#6465721)
I think OSS has delivered a lot of excellent products but the issue that remains unsolved is the UX side. UX is critical in mobile devices. A bad designed interface makes you switch to another application beyond the product features included.
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by dragandj on Sunday September 29, 2013 @05:19AM (#6464633)
As for text acrobatics, I doubt anything can beat LaTeX, which is free as in freedom AND free beer.
Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by pmelendez on Sunday September 29, 2013 @08:24AM (#6464979)
LaTex is awesome, period. But the learning curve is too high for common documents, which is fine because it was designed to be a great typesetting, not a word processor.

On the other hand, Word is great too, I wouldn't write a book on it but most of the time I am not writing books, as for free alternatives to Word, I find them sufficient but I would rather pay 10$ per month to use word and excel than work around libre office and its limitations.

Re:Why Free Software Is More Important Now Than Ever Before by abalone on Sunday September 29, 2013 @02:27PM (#6466025)
> Any sufficiently useful closed-source program will be cloned into open source in today's environment.

That is a parasitic and unsustainable model. Even if you could find enough volunteers to copy the work of every bit of successful commercial software, that original design and development work still needs to be funded.

Other commenters have noted the quality situation of many of the cloner projects out there. Even cloning takes work and sustainable, quality work needs remuneration.