News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by jenius on Tuesday March 19, 2013 @11:25PM (#5405427)
You absolutely nailed it with this comment. Was reading pieces of the debate out loud to my girlfriend, who is rather rational and intelligent but for some reason still wants a diamond ring (and I couldn't really figure out why) - when I read this and looked over, I knew you got it 100% right. Well done.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by blndcat on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @01:39AM (#5405834)
No such problem in my case. I explained I was strongly against the idea for most of the reasons listed in the original article and it wasn't a negotiable point. Basically if she still wanted the diamond ring then she didn't understand me well enough to be married to me. I didn't get all RMS-esque about it, but somethings are under our control, some aren't. It is one of those things that was. We got order-made platinum wedding rings instead.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by peterarmstrong on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @01:08AM (#5405760)
Yeah, the things that women do in order to outdo their female friends are expensive and pointless--almost as much so as the things that men do to outdo their male friends!
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by nawitus on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @06:19AM (#5406390)
At least men tend to spend their own money to increase social status by buying more expensive cars and gadgets.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by vadman on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @12:58PM (#5408515)
Well women spend their time and health bearing and nursing our (hopefully :) children. That's resources they could have dedicated to pumping their social status. So in the end it's fair I guess...
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by Goronmon on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @12:55AM (#5405729)
Yup, I've had a similar conversation.

Basically came down to some variation on "I don't ask for a lot (she doesn't), but I want the diamond ring."

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by kamaal on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @01:29AM (#5405813)
>>Basically came down to some variation on "I don't ask for a lot (she doesn't), but I want the diamond ring."

As some one newly married, I have observed the following.

    1. See <something>. Demand for it.
    2. When rationally explained why we can't buy it.
    3. Simply state.. "I don't ask for a lot, but I want the <something>."
    4. I buy it.
Repeat steps 1 - 4 endlessly.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by rytis on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @02:25AM (#5405920)
Did you try modifying step 2 to something along these lines:

"Great idea, I never thought about it, we really need <something>! Problem is, this particular model of <something> is not the best and will not do <something that something is supposed to do> very well. In fact I remember reading bad reviews about this. But fear not! We'll go home, spend some time reading review sites and will find a really good version of <something>."

This will buy you some time, and might even look that YOU want it, which might even make it less appealing to your other half. Now, find a really expensive model of something, but at such price point that the rationality wins, even in someone who usually does not listen to your arguments (step 2). YMMV, but sometimes this tactic works out quite well.

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by seanp2k2 on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @03:17AM (#5406009)
"actually I decided that I don't want to spend the rest of my life with someone who wants this badly to manipulate me to buy them something useless."

There are a lot of girls out there you haven't met yet. Go find one who gets you.

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by overgryphon on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @10:55AM (#5407613)
Interesting assumption there that he is buying her something. Agreeing as a married couple whether to spend money on something doesn't indicate that it is his or her money, the discussion implies that money is shared. For all you know if could be all her money in terms of income.

Of course if she wants it, it's useless.

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by transitionality on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @08:46PM (#5411930)
Gigolos servicing rich cougars don't ask for diamond rings.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by petercooper on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @07:25AM (#5406595)
That sounds like the process with my 3 year old daughter ;-) (though never my wife, luckily)
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by omegant on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @01:24AM (#5405802)
Then buy used (the diamond) and pay for a nice ring design. But don't tell her.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by lesterbuck on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @01:59AM (#5405870)
My grandfather ran a grocery store throughout the Depression, and he accumulated a large selection of diamond rings from cash strapped customers. When my father and his brother were getting married, they had their choice of the rings.

I've always wondered how other diamond rings get recycled or removed from the market. Diamonds are forever, after all, so why doesn't the price collapse from being awash in used stones from three or four generations of dead women?

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by jrmg on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @02:56AM (#5405963)
As we found out when looking for a ring, there is (perhaps manufactured) superstitious social stigma attached to using a used engagement ring. How do you know it's not from a failed marriage? Many jewelers were confused and incredulous when we asked about one.

After a certain age is reached though, the stigma seems to go away somewhat. We got a 'vintage' ring (about 100 years old) in the end - but they're hard to find; you won't find them in most chain jewelry stores.

Incidentally, the reason you don't see many used bands is different; the metals are worth so much now that it's more cost effective to melt them down than to resell them at the depressed price the market demands for used jewelry compared to new.

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by Thrall on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @08:24AM (#5406769)
> Many jewelers were confused and incredulous when we asked about one.

Bear in mind that it is in the jeweller's interest to perpetuate such superstitions as it means they can persuade many customers to buy a new ring instead.

Buying a diamonds as a romantic gesture, the buyer is vulnerable for two reasons:

1) They're unlikely to have much experience of buying jewellery; for many, this is the only occasion.

2) They probably feel very strongly about the gesture; it's very important that they get it right. Overspending pales beside the risk of offending the love of their life and/or subjecting them to negative judgement by their peers.

As a result, it is all too easy for jewellers to intimidate the buyer by telling them exactly what is 'expected' and charging absurd prices for it.

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by jrmg on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @11:29AM (#5407820)
Absolutely - which is why I said the sentiment was perhaps manufactured. We went to multiple jewellers though, big and small, and either _all_ the employees were great actors or at least some were genuinely surprised that we made the request.

Still, 'real' superstition or manufactured one, we didn't fall for it. I suspect many do though. A web search for "used engagement ring back luck" reveals the superstition is pretty widespread.

[Edit: Not that I mean that many people actually _believe_ that the used status of the ring will affect their marriage - I suspect they're more concerned on how their partner and, perhaps more so, their peers will judge their decision]

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by RougeFemme on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @11:51AM (#5407986)
Agreed. I accompanied my fiance when he shopped for my ring and most salespeople tried to tell both of us that we were wrong. We ended up getting it from a catalog.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by unreal37 on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @02:56AM (#5405966)
I would imagine diamond rings were rare during the Depression, while today they're common. Perhaps an entire year's sales of diamonds in 1930 takes place in a single day today. Wait til 1 or 2 generations from now. I'm willing to bet the entire racket will collapse on its own weight by then.
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by Someone on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @03:12AM (#5405996)
"Diamonds are forever, after all"

De Beers marketing worked on you. It is not that hard to destroy diamonds. Google "burning diamonds" for examples.

Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by ansgri on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @04:20AM (#5406123)
nobody does it, after all
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by kamaal on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @03:24AM (#5406023)
..And then deal with the crap storm that would erupt when she discovers about it..
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by omegant on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @05:22PM (#5410440)
If the ring is new but only the stone is "used", it´ll be hard to be discovered and still much cheaper. Even a refinished old ring would be quite hard to tell apart from a brand new one (unless your fiance is quite an expert on ring designs, and able to tell apart if a ring is 20 years old, then of course you better buy a new one). But don´t do it if you are not good at keeping secrets...
Re:Diamonds Are Bullshit by rorrr on Wednesday March 20, 2013 @12:37AM (#5405675)
Same with my wife. Told her about blood diamonds, and how the price is artificially inflated. She agreed. Still got the diamond ring.