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Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by rprasad on Saturday January 12, 2013 @07:02PM (#5049371)
No conspiracy, guys.

The prosecutor was just doing her job. A simple case like Aaron's probably took up less than 1% of her week. It may have been a big case to Aaron, but compared to their normal cases, it was a relative vacation for the prosecutors working on it.

The problem was not that Aaron "upset someone deeply entranched." The problem is that Aaron's activities fall into the definition of a particular form of electronic crime which may be overbroad. Federal prosecutors don't get to decide if laws are overbroad or unconstitutional and choose not to enforce the law (because this discretion was historically used to excuse many white defendants accused of lynching black men in the South). They enforce all of the laws on the books unless someone with legal discretion (i.e. ,the head of the DOJ or the president) issues an order telling them not to enforce a particular (set of) law(s).

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by todayiamme on Saturday January 12, 2013 @08:30PM (#5049608)
I think that the central assumption of your post is that I'm making the assumption that there was a systematic conspiracy to bring him to ruin. I am not alleging that. Neither am I stating anything towards the question whether or not his actions ran afoul of the spirit of the law. (indeed as this man asserts, there is reason to question that as well) I am simply stating an observation based upon the following;

a) the prosecutor's office has limited, finite resources to pursue cases

b) The prosecutor has discretion over the choice of cases

c) The office is judged by its record when it comes to the number of convictions and the quality of the cases pursued

d) It is reasonable to assume that the prosecutor acts as an agent, pursuing their own agenda versus the spirit of their duties. (the principal agent problem)

e) The legalities in Aaron's case are complicated and understood by a few.

f) It is also reasonable to assume that the case is inherently more risky than an open and shut guilty conviction, due to various factors such as, 1) the desire of MIT, JSTOR not to prosecute themselves, 2) expert witnesses such as the author of the article willing to provide testimony against the case, 3) the lack of a direct victim, and 4) questions over the inherent legality of the action itself.

g) In the above context it is reasonable to assert that the prosecutor without their well established tricks may have indeed lost this one if Aaron had the resources to have his day in court.

h) Aaron has a demonstrated previous track record of acting against the interests of the US govt. and the individuals it consists of.

i) Those individuals within the government have a social network

j) The said individuals are capable of and are willing to influence one another through this network

k) The prosecutor is a part of such a network by her very position within the government.

It is therefore reasonable to assume from the above assertions that it is likely the prosecutor was influenced to pursue the case with more rigour than necessary.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by drzaiusapelord on Saturday January 12, 2013 @08:12PM (#5049560)
So you're an up and coming prosecutor and handed the punk kid that took all those federal court documents and gave your colleagues a big middle finger when they tried to stop him.

Then JSTOR tells you to knock it off, but you proceed anyway.

And all this happens without Ortiz having any idea? Come on.

No one is saying Obama would know about this, but a bureaucrat on Ortiz's level does because its her job.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by erichocean on Saturday January 12, 2013 @08:15PM (#5049569)
Ortiz not only knew about it, but was rather zealously in favor of prosecuting Aaron (see the NYT article for more details).

She's at least as guilty as the actual prosecutors on the case.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by pekk on Saturday January 12, 2013 @07:28PM (#5049440)
Federal prosecutors do have a lot of discretion. I don't disagree with much of what you say, but this is just out of control and the only way for it to even start to get fixed is for heads to roll.
Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by darkarmani on Saturday January 12, 2013 @10:29PM (#5049864)
> The prosecutor was just doing her job.

If that is the case, then she is BAD at her job. You can't have it both ways. Either way, let everyone know that she is either bad at her job or overzealous.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by rprasad on Saturday January 12, 2013 @11:33PM (#5049981)
As a former criminal defense attorney, I will say that based on what has been published about her on HN and other websites she's actually very good at her job as a prosecutor, precisely because she is overzealous. In fact, if her fellow prosecutors are to be believed, she's one of the best federal prosecutors still working for the government--after all, she runs the Boston federal prosecutor's office, easily one of the top 4 most prestigious postings a lawyer can hold in the executive branch of the federal government.

From my point of view, she is no different from Jack Dorsey, or Steve Jobs, or all those other techheads who are revered for their overzealous and overbearing behavior. The difference is that most people on HN don't, can't, or refuse to understand what her job is and the legal and ethical obligations that come with it.

To put things in perspective: you probably feel the same way about this prosecutor as I feel about the guys running AirBnB.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by temphn on Sunday January 13, 2013 @12:37AM (#5050086)
Of course, Dorsey, Jobs, and the founders of AirBnB have produced products that millions of people use voluntarily and find useful. Ortiz and Heymann by contrast decided to threaten a kid with 35 years in jail for downloading pdfs, bankrupting him and driving him to suicide. The repeated claims that there is no such thing as "prosecutorial discretion" (!) and that they were just doing their "job" (!!) are just ludicrously false and Kafkaesque. The US Attorneys in this "prestigious office" knew well what they were doing. They chose to bring this case -- they could well have chosen to dismiss it and focus on one of the many serious violent crimes that happen in MA every year -- and they must be dismissed if there is to be any justice.

Somehow one is supposed to be outraged about someone renting out their spare bedroom to make ends meet, but not disturbed by an unelected official railroading and bankrupting Swartz? Indeed, to even defend this lack of accountability while attacking or derailing any measures to hold them accountable? This worldview is absolutely topsy-turvy and incomprehensible; insofar as it has any consistency, it seems to be pure apologia for untrammeled state power, obedience to authority, and rule by lawyers.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by wwweston on Sunday January 13, 2013 @03:21AM (#5050290)
> she's actually very good at her job as a prosecutor, precisely because she is overzealous.

While we're on the topic of things HN participants have trouble understanding, you may have a perspective on the legal system to add to the discussion, but you've apparently got something of a blind spot toward what the case you're building looks like outside that perspective.

At least, insofar as you're arguing that the legal system respects and the political system advances the careers of prosecutors who are overzealous (which, by definition, is disproportionate zeal).

> Jack Dorsey, or Steve Jobs, or all those other techheads who are revered for their overzealous and overbearing behavior.

This is like arguing that because some drug addicts are great artists, people should respect drug addicts.

I think it's pretty rare that you find people revered for overbearing and overzealous behavior itself -- when you find that behavior alone, in fact, you find people generally recognized as "assholes."

It's the other stuff that people like Jobs and Dorsey bring to the table that earns them respect and gets people lining up to work with them.

So if you want to make a comparison here that's going to hold up to any real scrutiny, you'd better be able to hold up to the world what Ortiz and her fellow overzealous prosecutors are contributing to the world besides their inordinate zeal -- what their singular gifts and rare qualities are.

Particularly in the moment when the most high profile product of that zeal is that seems to have contributed to someone's death.

You spent most of your comment defending that zeal instead, though. I don't know what that says about the strength of the case you hinted could be made about the details of a prosecutor's job and the legal and ethical obligations that come with it.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by mpyne on Sunday January 13, 2013 @10:24AM (#5050917)
> Particularly in the moment when the most high profile product of that zeal is that seems to have contributed to someone's death.

No offense to Aaron (who is by all accounts even smarter than I) but many, many people get charged with Federal crimes (even those with 30 year sentences) and don't go and kill themselves. Especially when they're as innocent as everyone describe him to be.

In some of those cases the defendant gets to use it as an opportunity to thumb their nose at the prosecution the entire way along (a kind of "reverse bully-pulpit"). It really sounded to me that Aaron had built a good case for himself once they dropped the trespassing charge, especially in light of everything that's come out since his suicide. So I don't understand it...

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by darkarmani on Monday January 14, 2013 @10:58AM (#5055128)
> To put things in perspective: you probably feel the same way about this prosecutor as I feel about the guys running AirBnB.

You feel like the guys running AirBnB are destroying people's lives?

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by tome on Sunday January 13, 2013 @02:59PM (#5051689)
Just out of curiosity, what are the other three of the top 4 most prestigious postings a lawyer can hold in the executive branch of the federal government?
Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by brown9-2 on Saturday January 12, 2013 @09:23PM (#5049722)
It may have been a big case to Aaron, but compared to their normal cases, it was a relative vacation for the prosecutors working on it.

This makes it even sadder then.

Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by temphn on Sunday January 13, 2013 @04:15AM (#5050377)

  Federal prosecutors don't get to decide if laws are   
  overbroad or unconstitutional and choose not to enforce the 
  law...They enforce all of the laws on the books unless 
  someone with legal discretion (i.e. ,the head of the DOJ or 
  the president) issues an order telling them not to enforce 
  a particular (set of) law(s).
Simply untrue.

"The USA [US Attorney] is invested by statute and delegation from the Attorney General with the broadest discretion in the exercise of such authority."

http://www.justice.gov/usao/eousa/foia_reading_room/usam/tit...

  The United States Attorney, within his/her district, has 
  plenary authority with regard to federal criminal matters. 
  This authority is exercised under the supervision and 
  direction of the Attorney General and his/her delegates.

  The statutory duty to prosecute for all offenses against 
  the United States (28 U.S.C. § 547) carries with it the 
  authority necessary to perform this duty. The USA is 
  invested by statute and delegation from the Attorney 
  General with the broadest discretion in the exercise of 
  such authority.

  The authority, discretionary power, and responsibilities of 
  the United States Attorney with relation to criminal 
  matters encompass without limitation by enumeration the 
  following:

  Investigating suspected or alleged offenses against the 
  United States, see USAM 9-2.010;

  Causing investigations to be conducted by the appropriate 
  federal law enforcement agencies, see USAM 9-2.010;

  Declining prosecution, see USAM 9-2.020;

  Authorizing prosecution, see USAM 9-2.030;

  Determining the manner of prosecuting and deciding trial 
  related questions;

  Recommending whether to appeal or not to appeal from an 
  adverse ruling or decision, see USAM 9-2.170;

  Dismissing prosecutions, see USAM 9-2.050; and

  Handling civil matters related thereto which are under the 
  supervision of the Criminal Division.
Re:The Truth About Aaron Swartz's "Crime" by askimto on Sunday January 13, 2013 @12:05AM (#5050040)
Right right she was forced to do it.