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Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Friday September 04, 2026 @10:27PM (#49572515)
What’s your angle here, exactly? I don’t get it.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by creato on Friday September 04, 2026 @10:46PM (#49572613)
That the issue of slavery has weak explanatory power for what is happening today.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Friday September 04, 2026 @10:54PM (#49572654)
I didn’t ask you. But since you chose to get involved: do you believe there is no lasting impact or consequences resulting from slavery in the USA?
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by WalterBright on Saturday September 05, 2026 @12:44AM (#49573137)
Pretty much everything that has happened in the past has consequences today. It's the butterfly effect.

Slavery has existed as far back as history. The idea that people are created equal, and are equal under the law, is very, very new, and that idea has resulted in a great many positive things happening.

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by anon84873628 on Saturday September 05, 2026 @10:38AM (#49576968)
You should check out this podcast episode with two historians, tracing the influence of the Confederacy ideology all the way to the current Supreme Court:

https://youtu.be/1i2VuPACBbU?si=8jv8XrRTLHJ9hHTu

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Friday September 04, 2026 @10:56PM (#49572661)
I'm anti-Trump. If you tell people "Trump is a corrupt asshole", that has a chance at convincing supporters to abandon him. If you tell people "the US needs a cultural revolution due to events from past centuries", that's what got him elected in the first place.

A good general wouldn't voluntarily shift the battleground to a region where their troops are weak. Political persuasion is no different. The Democratic Party keeps losing because they cling to unpopular positions on cultural issues. If Trump is as bad as you say, prove it to me by showing willingness to strategically cede ground on a few issues in order to win more voters.

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Friday September 04, 2026 @11:04PM (#49572709)
I’m generally aligned with your point, but I also don’t think the official position of the Democratic Party is that we need a cultural revolution, nor do I observe most Democrats feel that way.

What I do see is media and politicians on the Right characterizing extreme positions held by a minority of folks on the far Left as though they are adopted by the entire Left, and that weak uncritical minds on the Right believe that nonsense. Rush Limbaugh pioneered this technique to profit himself, and Trump gave him a fucking Presidential Medal of Freedom in his first term.

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Friday September 04, 2026 @11:24PM (#49572817)
I think you're somewhat underestimating how effectively the far-left minority has scared others into silence. Anyways, I do what I can to push back against them when they say things which seem wacky to me, as in this instance.

Maybe I should work harder to make my actual views clear. I added a few sentences to the end of my original comment in this thread: "I don't think this is a slavery thing. Trump just sucks." https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49572347

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Saturday September 05, 2026 @08:32AM (#49575919)
> I think you're somewhat underestimating how effectively the far-left minority has scared others into silence

Besides all the YouTube videos, X posts, the addition of two new right-wing TV networks (OANN and NEWSMAX), “Truth” Social, WSJ, NY Post, etc.? Silence is a myth perpetuated by the right (“people are trying to suppress the truth and your 1A rights!”) to build a following when in fact opposition voices are plentiful.

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Saturday September 05, 2026 @09:00AM (#49576112)
I don't think people on the right are scared. I think too many center-left Democrats are scared.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Saturday September 05, 2026 @09:53AM (#49576519)
Of what?
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Sunday September 06, 2026 @03:47AM (#49584205)
Censure and career threats by leftists.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by tupaarnaq on Saturday September 05, 2026 @09:33AM (#49576364)
Scared others into silence with what magical powers? Zero control of both chambers, zero control of the executive, military, cable news, Supreme Court, law enforcement etc. With what is this mighty far left minority scaring people? Protest sit-ins on campuses? That's what makes you quake?
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by vkou on Saturday September 05, 2026 @05:56AM (#49574952)
> because they cling to unpopular positions on cultural issues.

The Republican propaganda machine will always be ready to make any cultural issue the dems hold 'unpopular'. They turn anything and everything into a culture war, and if nothing exists, they are more than happy to manufacture it.

Observe how they turned their own vaccine into a cultural issue.

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Saturday September 05, 2026 @07:14AM (#49575428)
Many people, including me, not all of us Republicans, have observed that the Dems were much saner before 2010 or so.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Saturday September 05, 2026 @08:21AM (#49575850)
What happened around 2010 that might have precipitated whatever changes you’re thinking of?
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Saturday September 05, 2026 @09:01AM (#49576123)
Tumblr? Cultural shifts from social media started to gather momentum roughly around that time.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Saturday September 05, 2026 @10:07AM (#49576649)
There was a lot for people to be angry about, particularly the quagmires in Iraq and Afghanistan that the Bush administration got us into as a knee-jerk reaction to 9/11, combined with the 2008 financial crisis and Wall Street public bailout that culminated in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupy_Wall_Street
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Sunday September 06, 2026 @03:48AM (#49584211)
None of those events were the focus of the cultural shifts I'm referring to.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Monday September 07, 2026 @07:24AM (#49596994)
Maybe you should be more explicit about what you think really happened.
Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by anon84873628 on Saturday September 05, 2026 @10:30AM (#49576865)
This whole thread started with:

>We're still fighting the remnants of the confederacy. Germany and Japan in particular purged most of those elements from their society. Here we built statues to the evil fucks

That is a historical fact which has important explanatory power. It may not directly be the best basis for public Democratic platform, which most people probably agree with. The core manifestation is in our institutions, and that's what we need to fix. I agree with you that framing it through the lens of corruption is the best overt political strategy.

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by 0xDEAFBEAD on Sunday September 06, 2026 @03:46AM (#49584202)
Is this theory falsifiable? What would it look like if this problem was "fixed"? Many confederate statues were taken down--did anything change as a result? The entire thing seems like a delusional crusade against windmills. Focus on the present, not the past.

I get the sense that many in this thread simply have an un-quenched lust for re-education camps. Probably under Stalin they'd be mumbling about dastardly capitalist spies and saboteurs.

Re:Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread by otterley on Monday September 07, 2026 @07:16AM (#49596922)
> Many confederate statues were taken down--did anything change as a result? The entire thing seems like a delusional crusade against windmills. Focus on the present, not the past.

This sounds like a thinly-veiled argument to keep them up. But why should we keep them up? In what universe does it make sense to honor the losers of a failed coup attempt against our nation by embodying them in statutes?

The reason many continue to pursue this is because of the surprising number of people who want to maintain them. It's not a "crusade against windmills," it's a crusade against people who want to honor the enemies of our nation. It's as understandable as being upset that a group of people would want to maintain an Osama bin Laden statue in the middle of Manhattan.

Taking statues down may not change much in and of itself, but it's a small piece of the bigger puzzle.

> I get the sense that many in this thread simply have an un-quenched lust for re-education camps.

Well that escalated quickly.