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Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by MonkeyClub on Monday January 19, 2026 @11:43AM (#46681092)
> A lot of Americans believed the guy they wanted to believe in, because they didn't want to believe the people they didn't want to believe in.

It's sad but true. Deep down, political thinking is influenced by tribal thinking, a rigid us versus them mentality.

This is, after all, how the "divide and conquer" method gets to be so effective. A house divided amongst itself and all that.

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by CalChris on Monday January 19, 2026 @01:25PM (#46682627)
That’s a clever bothsiderism. However, these two tribes are not alike.
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by MonkeyClub on Monday January 19, 2026 @06:24PM (#46685986)
True, they're not alike, nor are the subtribes that are funneled into the two quasi-distinct groups.

But I think the methods by which they're being manipulated are quite alike, and ultimately forced to side with the current tribal figurehead simply because it's not the other tribe's figurehead, even if there are many, and legitimate, contentions.

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by johnnyanmac on Monday January 19, 2026 @10:08PM (#46687462)
>many, and legitimate, contentions.

When one chess player chooses to suddenly say that a pawn can move 3 spaces, and you insist on calling a ref to call out cheating, I don't think it's just "two tribes" anymore. You agreed on the rules of engagment at the beginning of the match and one side is objectively breaking them. Saying post haste that "well maybe a pawn should move 3 spaces" does not negate what you agreed upon.

That's why it's tiring to head the "but you're being manipulated" argument. Being manipulated by the very rules of your government is different from a bunch of war mongerers, billionaires, and corrupt politicians continually ignoring the rules and saying "no it's okay".

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by MonkeyClub on Tuesday January 20, 2026 @08:06AM (#46691423)
It is different, but it serves to elucidate that the rules we're living under aren't set in stone, they're only there because we, unlike the "no it's okay" bunch, can't or don't want to shirk them.

They operate under the "might is right" mentality, and by getting away with it prove in a sick and contorted way that the rules of social order aren't universal.

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by CalChris on Tuesday January 20, 2026 @01:19PM (#46695678)
So you’re saying we should be more like them AND applying a bothsiderism. Maybe conservatives should just straighten up and fly right. In fact, what have they ever gotten right?
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by thrance on Monday January 19, 2026 @02:51PM (#46683631)
You're acting like Democrats are as deep in the cult of personality as Republicans are, yet outside of the most corporate liberal circles, Harris and Biden are heavily held in contempt by most of the Left.
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by MonkeyClub on Monday January 19, 2026 @06:22PM (#46685965)
I get what you mean, and agree that

> Harris and Biden are heavily held in contempt by most of the Left.

To be absolutely frank, I don't consider the Democrat party as "Left" in any (traditional?) sense at all, even though it may include Left and Left-leaning elements.

(But then again I don't consider Starmer's Labour as Left either, and one could argue that Labour is more Left than the Democrats.)

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by nobody9999 on Monday January 19, 2026 @08:37PM (#46686828)
>To be absolutely frank, I don't consider the Democrat party as "Left" in any (traditional?) sense at all, even though it may include Left and Left-leaning elements.

The Democratic (not "Democrat", a member of that party is a Democrat, but the party is the "Democratic" Party), and calling it the "Democrat" party has its roots in Republicans deliberately misnaming the party as one of many attempts to devalue and dismiss the Democratic Party. If that's your goal, then please continue. Otherwise, it's like calling an Englishman a Limey or a Pommie just because you've heard others do so.

Otherwise, you're quite correct, in that the US Democratic Party is mostly a center-right party, with it's most progressive/left-wing elements being firmly center-left.

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by CalChris on Monday January 19, 2026 @07:18PM (#46686383)
No, Harris and Biden are not heavily held in contempt by most of the Left. I'm on the Left and voted for both of them. Indeed, as a Progressive, I was pleasantly surprised by Biden for his withdrawal from Afghanistan, student loan forgiveness, his canceling the Keystone Pipeline, etc.
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by immibis on Monday January 19, 2026 @07:47PM (#46686569)
Being pleasantly surprised by things that should be the bare minimum is not a sign you hold him in high regard. How do you feel about his attacks on Gaza?
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by CalChris on Monday January 19, 2026 @10:57PM (#46687757)
Biden had a resupply pier constructed for Gaza when Israel attacked. He didn't attack Gaza at all. Troll elsewhere.
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by immibis on Tuesday January 20, 2026 @03:59AM (#46689562)
Biden sold more weapons to Israel than any president before him.
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by thrance on Tuesday January 20, 2026 @03:58AM (#46689549)
Well, you should hold them in contempt for their awful 2024 campaign, their staunch pro-Israel position in the face of internal polls begging them to at least acknowledge what was going on in Gaza. You should hold the Democratic establishment in contempt too for their continued efforts to keep the progressives down: Sanders, AOC, now Mamdani...

Harris in particular, led a weak and energy-less campaign, disappeared for 6 month after losing, didn't do or say anything about Trump's terrible start, then reappeared for her book promotion and pinned it all on progressives.

I'm not telling you to disregard whatever good policies has come out of Biden's term, I'm telling you that's the barest of bare minimums, and winning an election against an obviously retared manchild such as Trump shouldn't be that fucking hard. Yet they lost, having down nothing to counter-message his many obvious lies. This deserves scorn, nothing else.

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by Izkata on Tuesday January 20, 2026 @11:55AM (#46694250)
> I was pleasantly surprised by Biden for his withdrawal from Afghanistan

You mean the one he postponed until months after the date Trump had already signed a deadline for?

Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by CalChris on Tuesday January 20, 2026 @01:15PM (#46695625)
Yawn. Trump wouldn’t even give the Biden transition team the terms of the agreement. Trump should have withdrawn his own withdrawal. He knew he was going to lose and like W created a minor debacle for his successor. Troll elsewhere.
Re:Kiel Institute Analysis: US Americans pay 96% of tariff b... by intangible on Tuesday January 20, 2026 @01:24PM (#46695750)
If only Trump had 4 years to do anything other than kick the can down to road yet again like every prior president.

Biden took the political hit by doing the right thing and ending the war - No prior president did that.