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Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by refulgentis on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:29AM (#46389684)
I appreciate a good debate. However, this won’t fit in one. It is tasteless, offensive, and stupid to compare storing the result of HTTP GET without paying someone to slavery in the 1800s. Full stop.

Anyone tempted to double down on this: sure, maybe, someday it’s like The Matrix or whatever. I was 12 when it came out & understood that was a fictional extreme. You do too. And you stumbled into a better analogy than slavery in 1800s.

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by mmooss on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:35AM (#46389710)
You're changing the subject. What about the actual point?
[dead]
Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by beeflet on Friday December 26, 2025 @02:07AM (#46389909)
Change the law so you can't train on copyrighted work without permission from the copyright holder.

>harassed

This just in, anonymous forum user SHOCKINGLY HARASSED, PELTED with HIGH-SPEED ideas and arguments, his positions BRUTALLY ATTACKED and PUBLICLY DEFACED.

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by anoncareer0212 on Friday December 26, 2025 @03:39AM (#46390349)
Been here for many years and haven’t seen behavior as boorish as this, especially from a self appointed debate club president.

Post you’re replying to:

Which is what? I’m honestly unsure. Could be: we need to nuke the data centers, or unseat any judge that has allowed this, or somehow move the law from “it’s cool to do matmuls with text as long as you have the right to read it.” Not against any of those but I’m sure I’m Other Team coded to you given the amount of harassment you’ve done in this thread to me and others.

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by beeflet on Saturday December 27, 2025 @12:57AM (#46399528)
I've been here longer than you have, this is my 100th alt account. The rules are for tools.

All of this meta-discussion of debating when/how we should debate or complaining how "rude" or "boorish" we are is more off-topic, boring and distracting than any flamewar.

The whole point of this site is to coerce public-facing people (like VC founders) into interacting with anonymous users and debating the ideas themselves. A sort of middle ground between reddit and 4chan. That's what all the "civility" and "kindness" talk is for.

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by jakelazaroff on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:34AM (#46389708)
I mean, yeah, if you omit any objectionable detail and describe it in the most generic possible terms then of course the comparison sounds tasteless and offensive. Consider that collecting child pornography is also "storing the result of an HTTP GET".
Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by refulgentis on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:46AM (#46389772)
What was the objectionable detail I forgot to include? Feeding the HTTP GET result to an AI? Then it’s the same as slavery? Sounds clearly wrong to me.
Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by jakelazaroff on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:58AM (#46389845)
No, I pointed out that your attempt to straw man my comment was so overly broad that it also describes collecting child pornography. Why not engage specifically with what I'm saying?
Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by anoncareer0212 on Friday December 26, 2025 @02:26AM (#46390014)
What didn’t they engage with?

It’s really hard to parse this thread because you and the other gentleman keep telling anyone who engages they aren’t engaging.

You both seem worked up and perceiving others as disagreeing with you wholesale on the very concept that AI companies could be forced to compensate people for training data, and morally injuring you.

Your conduct to a point, but especially their conduct, goes far beyond what I’m used to on HN. I humbly suggest you decouple yourself a bit from them, you really did go too far with the slavery bit, and it was boorish to then make child porn analogy.

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by jakelazaroff on Friday December 26, 2025 @02:38AM (#46390072)
If you believe my conduct here is inappropriate, feel free to alert the mods. I think it's pretty obvious why describing someone's objections to AI training data as "storing the result of an HTTP GET" is not a good faith engagement.
Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by anoncareer0212 on Friday December 26, 2025 @03:35AM (#46390329)
It’s not clear from anything either of you have written what the difference is between “AI training data” and “storing the result of an HTTP GET [and matmul’ing it]” is.

All we have is an exquisite, thoughtful, nuanced, analogy of how it is exactly like America enslaving Black people in the 1800s. i.e. a cheap appeal to morality.

Then, it is followed by repeated brow-beating comment to anyone who replied, complaining something wasn’t being engaged with.

What exactly wasn’t being engaged with?

It is still unclear.

Do feel free to share, or apologize even. It’s understandable you went a bit too far because you really do feel it’s the same as slavers in the 1800s in America, what’s not understandable is complaining no one is engaging correctly.

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by dang on Saturday December 27, 2025 @02:30PM (#46404434)
We've banned this account. Please don't use multiple accounts in arguments on HN. It will eventually get your main account banned as well.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by ronsor on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:42AM (#46389743)
The objection to CSAM is rooted in how it is (inhumanely) produced; people are not merely objecting to a GET request.
Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by beeflet on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:57AM (#46389835)
Yes, they're objecting to people training on data they don't have the right to, not just the GET request as you suggest.

If you distribute child porn, that is a crime. But if you crawl every image on the web and then train a model that can then synthesize child porn, the current legal model apparently has no concept of this and it is treated completely differently.

Generally, I am more interested in how this effects copyright. These AI companies just have free reign to convert copyrighted works into the public domain through the proxy of over-trained AI models. If you release something as GPL, they can strip the license, but the same is not true of closed-source code which isn't trained on.

Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by jakelazaroff on Friday December 26, 2025 @01:46AM (#46389774)
Indeed, and neither is that what people are objecting to with regard to AI training data.
Re:Rob Pike Goes Nuclear over GenAI by tremon on Friday December 26, 2025 @07:19AM (#46391376)
That's not true, since cartoon drawings and certain manga also fall in that category. Do you have any evidence that manga is produced inhumanely?