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Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by guard-of-terra on Saturday October 06, 2012 @11:14AM (#4620714)
All this would do is a short-term depression of SF programmer wages coupled to short-term surge in worldwide programmer wages. Because guess what, smart guy in Ukraine was already employed there and when he moves the next guy coming to fill the gap will either cost more or be less smart.

Programmer talent is sparse worldwide, not just in the Valley.

Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by randomdata on Saturday October 06, 2012 @12:02PM (#4620834)
Programmer talent is sparse worldwide

And yet, when I look around at the job postings in Canada, a job with requirements that go on endlessly tops out at about $80,000/year. Expect less if you are an average programmer. Such a low income, relative to what US-based companies are offering, doesn't really speak to a shortage in my mind.

I admit, there could be some kind of survivorship bias here: I'm only seeing the lower-paying jobs because the good jobs are less likely to be hanging around on the job boards. But then if an $80,000/yr. job is failing to attract talent, should it even be considered a real position with respect to shortage counting? I could hire dozens of programmers if they would only do it for $10/hr., but I don't think it is fair to count those as unfilled positions or a shortage surrounding that. Nobody with talent is ever going to do it for that kind of pay.

Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by psykotic on Saturday October 06, 2012 @01:35PM (#4621090)
> a job with requirements that go on endlessly tops out at about $80,000/year

An endless list of job requirements is a sign the company doesn't know what it wants, so it's hardly surprising they don't know how much to pay their programmers, either.

Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by randomdata on Saturday October 06, 2012 @04:53PM (#4621669)
Endless list was an exaggeration, but the requirements were very specific: A CS degree requirement, experience with specific technologies, etc. The kind of stuff you might add when people are fighting for the job in order to scare some away. You can't afford to scare anyone away if a shortage is real.

Though your point may still hold true, however I've seen it often enough that I find it surprising that so many companies (many of whom specialize in tech) are that out of touch.

Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by 3pt14159 on Saturday October 06, 2012 @12:51PM (#4620973)
They do not top out at 80k, but for positions that are truly senior companies don't even post those on job boards. You need to network and get noticed if you want to be earning 130 or 150 here.
Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by randomdata on Saturday October 06, 2012 @01:11PM (#4621030)
But a shortage would see throwing those $150K+ jobs to just about anyone who can turn on a computer. The fact that you have to have existing networks and secret handshakes to even find such jobs is not what a shortage looks like, it is just a normally functioning market.
Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by veemjeem on Saturday October 06, 2012 @12:11PM (#4620861)
I'm guessing the payment scales depend on the cost of living in your area. They pay more in Silicon Valley compared to Toronto because a 1500 sqft single family home in SV is around $1M.
Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by typicalrunt on Saturday October 06, 2012 @04:25PM (#4621593)
You'd be surprised at the house prices in Toronto or Vancouver (2 of the top tech cities in Canada). Yes, we're undergoing a housing bubble here, but $1M is the average price of a detached home in Vancouver...and that's for a 50+ year old hunk of junk (or 'crack shack' as we call it here).

One of the reasons that the housing bubble is starting to pop in Canada is that the incomes can no longer support the housing prices. We tend to have lower incomes than the US, but our houses are more expensive, cost of living is here, higher taxes, goods are more expensive, etc etc.

I wonder if SV incomes are higher simply because people expect them to be higher, or maybe there are more fundamentals to it.

Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by yxhuvud on Saturday October 06, 2012 @03:18PM (#4621405)
And then there are Stockholm where I paid about $300k for roughly 365 square feet a month ago or so...
Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by guard-of-terra on Saturday October 06, 2012 @12:45PM (#4620958)
What is the average job offering in Canada? How does it compare? What occupations pay significantly more? Do they pay that immediately after joining or the good compensation does not kick in until quite a few years has passed? How large are those professions by the headcount?

I think we can find the source of this distortion if it exists. All I can say right now is that areas where you have access to money not backed by productivity tend to trump programming or any other jobs where the employer has to make ends meet. Those areas are usually law, sometimes medicine (often not), and some public sector / government contractors.

Re:Do you really want to be making this much money when you'... by cunac on Saturday October 06, 2012 @06:59PM (#4622032)
in Toronto area you can get senior dev position fairly easy in range 95k - 110k and I can tell you from personal experience it is very hard to find decent developer (just decent would make us happy) , usually is 1 of 20 interviews if we are lucky