Comparing raising your children, cooking food for your family, and maintaining the home to slavery is… quite the position..

It’s certainly hyperbolic but lack of autonomy and complete financial dependence were pretty par for the course for women back in the day.

My grandma slowly squirreled away money in a shoe box over decades as she had no personal bank account and lived on what my grandpa provided while she took care of seven kids. She saw it as her lifeline. Meanwhile he got drunk every night at the yacht club.

When the last of the kids were nearing college she spent that money on classes for clerical work and got a job.

I could not possibly imagine being in her shoes and I can imagine why a woman would be loathe to enter into such dependence on another person, regardless of how fulfilling child rearing and house keeping may be.

And the further you go back from there the worse it looks for women.

100% agreed - the lack of choice is terrible, and society is better now that women have more freedom.

I think what people look back and get nostalgia for is the fact that it was possible for one adult to stay at home full time. Now its not possible; we dont have a choice, everyone must work.

What about when they’re 9 years old?

And what about women who love their family and kids and would like to support the family by staying at home? Come on dude, calling it slavery is fucked up.

or men, for that matter. no reason it has to be the woman to stay home and support the family.

Of course. I agree.

Is a cultural perception that raising children and a family is being a slave. I personally find it a disgusting perception. I love my family.

I think more people will find disgusting walking over all the abuse women had to endure you did here.

earlier wife beating was „normal thing” leaving abusive partners was not possible or much harder than nowadays.

Then in a lot of places in the world it still is like that.

I don't know in what culture you were raised. My culture has no history of systematic wife beating.

What kind of comment is that?

Do you feel superior or somehow you just make my argument not true because it didn't happen to you or anyone you know?

You definitely seem to be genuine asshole and I don't care what culture you were raised in because there are definitely nicer people from that culture.

I'm Jewish. We hold our women in high esteem.

I wouldn't characterize raising a family as slavery, I also won't debate the prevelance of domestic violence in Jewish families (those curious can google it), but pointing out that you're from a culture that represents a rounding error of the world population doesn't strengthen your argument.

I am at the gym, can’t talk.

Bro but you called.

Are you positive about this?

Am I positive about what? That my culture does not have a history of wife beating? Yes, I am positive.

I have no idea what your culture is, but the entire notion that domestic violence is something to be monitored and prevented by outsiders was invented very recently in most cultures. So my assumption is that it was pretty damn widespread everywhere, no matter what our ancestors like to tell us.

So you have an assumption that contradicts the teachings of our holiest texts, which we are known to adhere to.

I'm sure some incidences have occurred throughout history. But some cultures actually prescribe when [1] one should beat their wife. Ours forbids it.

  [1] Quran Al-Nisa 34: "For women you suspect to be disloyal: admonish them, refuse to share their beds, strike them."

I assume this is just garden-variety "being racist on the Internet" commentary, but in case you actually believe this: go ask ChatGPT for a list of the sections that urge murder and violence against women in any given holy text.

You believe ChatGPT over the holy Quran?

And where do you see me being racist? Where did I mention race anywhere?

Consulting ChatGPT was an interesting exercise, thank you.

  > Me: Please provide a list of holy book verses that prescribe violence against one's wife.

ChatGPT:

Here are the major holy book verses that are most often cited in connection with violence specifically against one’s wife:

Qur’an

Qur’an 4:34 – "…As to those women on whose part you fear disobedience, admonish them, forsake them in bed, and strike them…".

Hebrew Bible / Old Testament

No verse prescribes a man striking his wife as a disciplinary measure.

New Testament

There are no verses in the New Testament that permit a husband to strike or kill his wife. Passages instead emphasize submission:

Ephesians 5:22–24 – Wives should submit to their husbands.

Colossians 3:18 – Wives submit to husbands.

Hindu Texts (Manusmriti)

Manusmriti 8.299–300 – Advises physical punishment of wives for misconduct (using a rope or split bamboo). (Not a “holy book” for all Hindus, but historically influential in law.)

Summary:

The only major canonical verse that explicitly prescribes a husband striking his wife is Qur’an 4:34. Other scriptures (Torah, New Testament) do not instruct husbands to physically punish wives, though they prescribe harsh penalties (often death) for unmarried women’s sexual transgressions.

Would you like me to also include later religious legal codes (like Talmudic halakha, Islamic fiqh rulings, Canon law), or just stick strictly to the scriptural verses themselves?

And many couples are tired of both having to go to work and outsource the childcare to third parties to be able to afford the mortgage which is high because everyone has two incomes.

Do you have any idea how many women hate having to work and would you rather be raising a family?