News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by jacquesm on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @12:53PM (#44963596)
So much freedom. It is scary to see how fast the USA is falling. But at least we now have an answer to how this all could have happened in Germany, why they didn't stop the builders of the concentration camps and how come the 'good Germans' did nothing. The price is a little steep though.

The most surprising thing to me is that people that are by most measures intelligent are falling for it hook, line, and sinker.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by chrisco255 on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:47PM (#44964234)
The Federal government has always had broad lateral regulatory powers over the influx and outflux of people and goods across the border, citizens or not. The U.S. has had laws on the book to this effect all the way back to 1789. This is one of the defining features of a sovereign country. There's not a single country on planet earth that doesn't permit searches at the border.

See for yourself: https://www.repository.law.indiana.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?a...

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by jacquesm on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @02:48PM (#44964942)
Thank you for entirely missing the point here and illustrating mine by being one of those good people that keep on justifying what is happening by pointing to legal texts. In what world do you think it is normal for border patrol to search private devices? I've crossed in and out of former East Germany and Poland when they were still behind the iron curtain and never ever had to so much as show what I had in my pockets. By the time countries like that were examples to be held up to countries that nominally value personal freedom, freedom of expression and freedom from political and religious persecution you have to wonder if you are not in the words of Mitchell and Webb 'the baddies'.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by chrisco255 on Tuesday August 26, 2025 @04:31PM (#45031962)
> I've crossed in and out of former East Germany and Poland when they were still behind the iron curtain and never ever had to so much as show what I had in my pockets.

I know there were exceptions for Yugoslavians and others but in general, for especially USSR citizens and Western German citizens, the flow of people across the iron curtain was incredibly regulated and especially soviets trying to flee east Germany were regularly executed. So please spare me your diatribe.

The guards, if they chose to at any time, could have detained you and questioned you. The police could have searched you at any time anywhere in the USSR whether you were a citizen or not.

In Russia this is still the case to this day.

Of course all sovereign countries, whether "bad or not" reserve the right to search anything you seek to drag into their borders. This goes without saying! No country is under an obligation to host you, you are a guest.

And no country has to subject itself to sabotage, political incitement, criminal activity, foreign lobbying, espionage, etc, from foreigners. Period.

You don't have a right to import anything in to any country without it being potentially searched. That is called border control. Every country does it to some extent, some more thoroughly than others.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by barbazoo on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:10PM (#44963783)
> So much freedom.

About half of Americans apparently don't have a passport and according to other sources I found only about <30% of Americans have travelled internationally in the past year.

So I imagine this revocation of freedom doesn't affect everyone equally. Presumably things are still mostly fine for those folks or at least they wouldn't have experienced it.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by alistairSH on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:13PM (#44963822)
2/3 of the US population lives within the border zone (defined as within 100 miles of any border or entry point). Likewise, every major city is basically one giant border zone.

So, you could conceivably be a citizen, but CBP/ICE think you might be here illegally, so they can stop you without a warrant. How are you going to prove you're a citizen? There is no national ID, passports aren't required nor are they held by the majority of citizens, and unless something has changed, green card holders / permanent residents aren't required to carry their papers.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by filoleg on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:46PM (#44964223)
> [...] unless something has changed, green card holders / permanent residents aren't required to carry their papers.

I agree with your larger overall point, but this specific part isn't true.

Nothing has changed recently, but green card holders/permanents residents (over the age of 18) have been required to carry their green card with them since a long time ago (since the implementation of the Alien Registration Act of 1940, according to Google). I remember back when I got mine in 2012, it was a requirement as well (though, I will admit, it was not really enforced).

Here is the relevant quote from Section 264(e) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (I.N.A.)[0] addressing this:

> Every alien, eighteen years of age and over, shall at all times carry with him and have in his personal possession any certificate of alien registration or alien registration receipt card issued to him pursuant to subsection (d). Any alien who fails to comply with the provisions of this subsection shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall upon conviction for each offense be fined not to exceed $100 or be imprisoned not more than thirty days, or both.

And here[1] is an additional resource confirming this.

0. https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid%3AUSC-prel...

1. https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/do-i-really-need-car...

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by alistairSH on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @03:19PM (#44965314)
Huh, that's interesting... certainly nobody I know with a green card (myself and my family included prior to 1997) ever carried it daily. They were generally kept in the "important papers" box/safe with passports and things.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by filoleg on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @04:04PM (#44965840)
Ayup, literally same. I know mom carried for a bit, but then decided that she was running a higher risk of losing it that way, and did the same thing you did. It was not really enforced in recent times, but we knew that it was technically still required on paper.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by smcin on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:57PM (#44964380)
> you could conceivably be a citizen, but CBP/ICE think you might be here illegally, so they can stop you without a warrant.

That's terrible advice, please stop giving terrible advice like that. ICE need to have probable cause (about you specifically, by name, not just your street or zipcode or "people of your ethnicity/appearance" or "people in that store/restaurant/parking lot"), beyond a verbal "uhh we think you're here illegally". You have the right to ask them why. And the 4th Amdt still exists, for all people, so no they can't stop you in your vehicle or inside your own house without probable cause and a [signed, valid] warrant [naming you specifically, and signed by a judge].

> How are you going to prove you're a citizen?

If you're a citizen, you can simply state to them you're a citizen (better when you're on bodycam; and repeat it (on bodycam) to any other ICE officials you interact with, and make mental note of their names or else descriptions so you can subsequently identify them). Pragmatically, you could also identify yourself as such to any bystanders or anyone videoing things.

"U.S. citizens do not have to carry proof of citizenship if they are in the U.S." [0] Read that again and again. Ok?

For sure ICE could knowingly violate a citizen's rights, detain them unlawfully (for hours or days), beat them up, send them to a detention center, even (in very rare cases) deport them. That becomes a political as much as legal matter. If you have constitutional/legal rights and due-process but refuse to stand up for them, do those rights functionally cease to exist? Do they magically get restored in 2029(/2033)? Time to stop being complacent.

(Obviously noncitizens do not have all the above protections, and need to be more careful.)

In the meantime, to inform yourself about your rights, and to get advice how to deal with ICE, both for citizens, GC holders, visa holders, visitors and undocumented people, see: https://www.aclu.org/ or other webinars. But, stop speculating or spreading misinformation. If you don't know, ask here.

[0]: https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/immigrants-rights

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by SwamyM on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @03:40PM (#44965551)
> That's terrible advice, please stop giving terrible advice like that. ICE need to have probable cause (about you specifically, by name, not just your street or zipcode or "people of your ethnicity/appearance" or "people in that store/restaurant/parking lot"), beyond a verbal "uhh we think you're here illegally". You have the right to ask them why. And the 4th Amdt still exists, for all people, so no they can't stop you in your vehicle or inside your own house without probable cause and a [signed, valid] warrant [naming you specifically, and signed by a judge].

This is technically true but in practice (as we've seen multiple times recently), if ICE wants to stop you or interrogate you or even arrest you, they will do so without a warrant.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by alistairSH on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @03:50PM (#44965675)
I have an accent. If ICE stops me at a traffic check (which they run on public streets in DC) and asks for my papers (which I can't provide, as I'm a citizen), am I just supposed to hope and pray they take me at my word? Not a great system. And as much as I'd love to take it to the man, I'm just going to avoid downtown for now.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by text0404 on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:15PM (#44963845)
> So I imagine this revocation of freedom doesn't affect everyone equally. Presumably things are still mostly fine for those folks or at least they wouldn't have experienced it.

Sure, and most Americans have never had their speech censored by a government entity so getting rid of the first amendment would be fine for most people.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by rconti on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:19PM (#44963891)
| only about <30% of Americans have travelled internationally in the past year

30% sounds insanely high. I suspect at least half of Americans haven't even taken a _vacation_ in the past year, let alone _travelled internationally_.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by splap on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @02:00PM (#44964412)
only 3% of us citizens had a passport back in 1989!

passport to resident ratio usa, 1989-2023:

https://claude.ai/public/artifacts/44102530-5b24-467a-8510-c...

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by FireBeyond on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:29PM (#44963994)
Yeah, the number is closer to 10%:

> Approximately 40 million Americans travel abroad each year. This figure represents about 12% of the U.S. population. Travel data reveals that Americans commonly visit destinations in Europe, Canada, Mexico, and the Caribbean.

Source: https://travelpander.com/how-many-americans-travel-abroad/

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by rconti on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:37PM (#44964101)
Higher than I would have thought! I was just thinking about this again and my SWAG was 5%. I asked ChatGPT which repeated the shockingly high 28% number, but it elides the fact that this was in a (small) survey of 2000 "travelers" (whatever that means-- but i suspect it means 2000 people who travelled in the past year):

> In the past year, the poll of 2,000 U.S. travelers, conducted by Talker Research, found 94% have traveled domestically, and 28% have traveled internationally.

source: https://www.myjournalcourier.com/features/article/unpacking-...

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by abeppu on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:48PM (#44964247)
... that's not how freedom works?

Even if I happen not to hold any particularly radical political opinions, if political speech is censored, my rights of free expression are also decreased. I may not practice a minority religion, but if the state systemically attacks one religion, my freedom of religion is also attacked.

The same is no less true for the 4th amendment; I may not be a target of the police at the current moment, but if they have the ability to search and take stuff at will, I am still less free.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by wat10000 on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:23PM (#44963934)
If we've learned anything from the catastrophes of the 20th century, it should be that you need to resist attacks on freedom even when they only involve smaller groups, because they will come for you eventually and by then it may be too late.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by potato3732842 on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:31PM (#44964018)
That's hard to do in practice when at any given moment the people screeching about a given affront are the same people who were cheering AML/KYC a decade ago because they didn't like tax evasion and the people screeching about that were all in favor of invasive policing over drugs a decade before that and so on and so on.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by wat10000 on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @02:19PM (#44964617)
Resisting tyranny is hard, who knew.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by dmitrygr on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @12:58PM (#44963657)
This is not new and started under obama. Courts have ruled that until you pass customs you are not IN the country and thus 4th amendment does not apply. IF you are a citizen, it STILL DOES apply so they cannot force you into a search or deny you entry but they can confiscate your device.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by NoGravitas on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:07PM (#44963751)
And it would have started before Obama if smartphones were a common thing back then.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by dmitrygr on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @02:57PM (#44965055)
100%. No government has ever skipped an opportunity to grab more control. My message was in no way partisan, just historical.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by sugarpimpdorsey on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @02:54PM (#44965011)
Try entering Australia sometime and report back.

The ABF are empowered to search any electronic devices, copy and retain its contents.

You can refuse, after which they are empowered to jail you and seize your belongings.

Sorry but I'm not seeing the connection between searching belongings whilst crossing an international border to the mass genocide of 6M people.

Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by jacquesm on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @03:10PM (#44965199)
> You can refuse, after which they are empowered to jail you and seize your belongings.

Or you can vote with your feet and stop going there.

> Sorry but I'm not seeing the connection between searching belongings whilst crossing an international border to the mass genocide of 6M people.

Nazism did not start with genocide. It ended with genocide. If your position is that as long as we haven't seen the death of 6M people then sure, you're right this isn't Nazism. But if you see the endless propaganda, the creations of large 'outgroups' and the building of actual concentration camps as possibly leading in that direction then now would be a good time to do something about it. Otherwise you'll be in a long line of people saying 'wir haben es nicht gewusst' in a couple of years. But you did.

[dead]
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by selectodude on Wednesday August 20, 2025 @01:17PM (#44963871)
Mike Godwin agrees that we’re witnessing Nazi shit.
Re:Phone searches at the US border hit a record high by tempodox on Thursday August 21, 2025 @06:15AM (#44970995)
> The price is a little steep though.

Sadly that's usual for learning such things first hand.