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Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by ants_everywhere on Monday August 04, 2025 @08:53AM (#44785119)
I don't believe this is true. The idea that the US should be non-democratic is very fringe. It's frequently expressed online, but a lot of that is not from human Americans.

If you know of a high quality poll showing a majority of people support turning the US into a non-Democratic form of government I'd be very interested to see it and I would be legitimately surprised.

The polls I see have at least 70-80% endorsement of the importance of democracy across the political spectrum.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by yosito on Monday August 04, 2025 @10:19AM (#44786159)
I'm not saying that people don't think that the US should be a democracy. I'm saying that people don't think the US is a democracy. When the president of the country is a criminal and blatantly ignores the constitution and the courts, what does democracy even mean?

Edit: I'm not here to debate this or to defend that view, it's simply my observation of what people think these days, from my perspective here in Thailand.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by sofixa on Monday August 04, 2025 @09:12AM (#44785288)
> The idea that the US should be non-democratic is very fringe

The theoretical idea, maybe.

In practice, one party dismantling democratic institutions and checks and balances, or stacking the courts, or accepting bribes in public, or drawing districts in a way to benefit them are normal, accepted practices that a lot of Americans (especially on one side of the two party system) accept and actively cheer on, because it's their side that is "winning".

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by adamc on Monday August 04, 2025 @09:38AM (#44785619)
Yes, that party has gone over to the dark side. That doesn't mean the majority of their voters necessarily agree with that.
Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Monday August 04, 2025 @09:43AM (#44785687)
Sorry, this is Orwellian doublespeak. I don't know exactly what "democratic institutions" you're referring to, but you seem to be referring to administrative agencies and adjuncts that are the exact opposite of "democratic institutions." They're anti-democratic checks that are permanently in the control of one party, regardless of who wins elections.

You mention "checks and balances" but which ones are you referring to? All three branches of government are controlled by the same party. Perhaps you can clarify if I'm mistaken, but you seem to be referring to anti-democratic putative "checks" within the executive branch. Those are nowhere in the constitution.

What's the big news right now? Republicans defunding NPR, which spent the last five years calling republicans and white people "racist." Sorry, that's democracy in action!

> In practice, one party dismantling democratic institutions and checks and balances, or stacking the courts, or accepting bribes in public, or drawing districts in a way to benefit them are normal,

California's "independent redistricting commission" drew a map where republicans have 17% of the seats despite getting 40% of the vote. That's worse than Maryland's quite deliberately gerrymandered map, where republicans got 16% of seats despite getting 35% of the vote. "Independent" redistricting commissions get taken over by democrats in practice, like every other putatively non-partisan political body.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by sofixa on Monday August 04, 2025 @11:21AM (#44787088)
> You mention "checks and balances" but which ones are you referring to? All three branches of government are controlled by the same party. Perhaps you can clarify if I'm mistaken, but you seem to be referring to anti-democratic putative "checks" within the executive branch. Those are nowhere in the constitution.

Didn't the Supreme Court, stacked by Republicans, decide that Presidents on official business are immune to prosecution, on a case against a Republican president? That's one massive check eviscerated for political reasons.

> Republicans defunding NPR, which spent the last five years calling republicans and white people "racist.

What the fuck are you on. Please provide sources, let's at least once a month, of NPR calling "republicans and white people" racist. I'd be shocked if you can find one single instance of that (other than, of course, legitimate cases such as JD Vance saying that Haitian migrants are eating pets, which was something he himself admitted to inventing, and clearly racist).

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Monday August 04, 2025 @11:41AM (#44787379)
> Didn't the Supreme Court, stacked by Republicans, decide that Presidents on official business are immune to prosecution, on a case against a Republican president? That's one massive check eviscerated for political reasons.

The constitutional “checks and balances” are between the three branches. The prospect of the President being prosecuted by his own executive branch is not a “check” contemplated by the constitution. The constitution does not incorporate this modern idea of a “neutral justice system” that can be trusted to enforce the law regardless of politics. (If such neutral bodies existed, the whole tripartite system of government would be pointless.)

The DOJ, like virtually every group of lawyers, is 80-90% Democrats. If you posit an “independent DOJ” that can prosecute the former president, and leading candidate for reelection, then you’re envisioning a government where unelected Democrats hold permanent power over elections.

> What the fuck are you on. Please provide sources, let's at least once a month, of NPR calling "republicans and white people" racist. I'd be shocked if you can find one single instance of that (other than, of course, legitimate cases such as JD Vance saying that Haitian migrants are eating pets, which was something he himself admitted to inventing, and clearly racist).

So we’re going to judge what’s “legitimately” racist through what Democrats think is racist? It’s like you’re trying to prove my point! Expanding the concept of “racism” to encompass unrelated beliefs and preferences is a liberal idea, and baked into almost everything NPR does.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by sofixa on Monday August 04, 2025 @02:49PM (#44789918)
> So we’re going to judge what’s “legitimately” racist through what Democrats think is racist? It’s like you’re trying to prove my point! Expanding the concept of “racism” to encompass unrelated beliefs and preferences is a liberal idea, and baked into almost everything NPR does

Are you claiming that lying about Haitians eating pets to get people to vote for your anti-immigration platform isn't racist? How do you figure that?

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Monday August 04, 2025 @06:31PM (#44792073)
The traditional definition of “racism” focuses on treating individuals differently because of their immutable characteristics. Democrats have turned that concept on its head, to encompass opposing cultural change to a community from mass migration of people from foreign cultures. Regarding the specific example, the “food versus pet” distinction is a core one in any culture.[1] Vance’s story aptly illustrates the cultural friction that’s happening. Stephen Colbert would call it “truthy.”

[1] When I was a kid, my muslim immigrant mom told me not to marry a white girl because “they eat snakes.” I married a white girl, and she had in fact eaten a snake before. Culture is a real thing that exists, and it’s okay to prefer your own!

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by wmorgan on Monday August 04, 2025 @11:05PM (#44793896)
This so-called traditional definition returns too many false negatives. It would exclude, for example, the inflammatory newspapers of the Jim Crow era. Americans learned with tragic regularity in the Post-Reconstruction era why spreading racial rumors is so reckless. It doesn’t matter to the moral calculus that the rumors were "truthy." The norm against expressing racial prejudice predates the most recent party realignment; it's amply represented in WW2 training materials. This is not a new thing.
Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Monday August 04, 2025 @11:57PM (#44794189)
We live in 2025, not 1875. The sentiments we’re talking about aren’t rooted in “racial prejudice” constructed to maintain a slave society. They’re rooted in the same reaction that folks would have if tens of thousands of desperately poor Appalachians were resettled in a small town in Vermont or Massachusetts. It’s not antipathy over in immutable characteristics, but actual differences in the aggregate behavior of large groups of foreigners as compared to the existing population.

Democrats’ modern definition takes the social norm against declaring people inferior based on immutable characteristics and uses it to bash through cultural relativism and suppress criticism of cultural change.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by wmorgan on Tuesday August 05, 2025 @02:08PM (#44801902)
This analysis would seem to exonerate even Pat Buchanan, who by the 1990s had learned to couch all his rhetoric in terms of culture rather than race.

> I think God made all people good. But if we had to take a million immigrants in, say Zulus, next year, or Englishmen, and put them in Virginia, which group would be easier to assimilate and would cause less problems for the people of Virginia?

Nevertheless, his comments drew contemporary accusations of racism. So how modern are we talking about? This was well-trod discourse in 1992.

Buchanan and Vance had every possible culture to draw from to make their points, but they reached for Zulus and Haitians, two nations of Black people whose most famous historical event is a somewhat-successful war against White people. It strains credulity that this messaging is not fine-tuned to the electorate.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by jacquesm on Wednesday August 06, 2025 @04:58AM (#44809563)
> We live in 2025, not 1875.

Soon you'll get to relive 1875, but now with cell phones.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by sofixa on Tuesday August 05, 2025 @06:57AM (#44796535)
> Culture is a real thing that exists, and it’s okay to prefer your own!

Yes, it is. There is quite the leap from "preferring your own" to lying about a specific group are doing something morally objectionable, in order to reinforce your campaign's anti-immigration messaging, though.

And yes, it is racist to lie about a group of people you don't like to make them sound worse so that other people don't like them too.

Like it was racist when Nazis said that Jews control the world and ate children and whatever nonsense you can think of.

Targeting a specific group of people's immutable characteristics to slander them to paint them negatively fits your "original" definition of racism. The couch fucker treated them differently, by lying that they specifically are eating pets.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Tuesday August 05, 2025 @08:32AM (#44797222)
> Targeting a specific group of people's immutable characteristics to slander them to paint them negatively fits your "original" definition of racism

Nobody targeted anyone’s immutable characteristics. If you object to 10,000 Appalachians being resettled in your New England town, that’s not “racism.” It’s an objection based on not wanting them to do to your town what they did to their hometowns in Appalachia. It’s about peoples’ culture and how that manifests in the communities they create.

I think this is hard for liberals to understand because they’re so steeped in cultural relativism. They assume that cultural differences cannot be substantive—cannot shape the communities people create in substantive ways. So they cannot understand why anyone would object to mass settlement of culturally distinct groups except out of prejudice against immutable characteristics. Oddly, they seem to have this blind spot only for non-white people. Most would agree that West Virginia is the way it is because of West Virginians. But Bangladesh isn’t the way it is because of Bangladeshis, and it’s “racist” to suggest that importing 50,000 Bangladeshis to an enclave in the US would recreate dynamics that prevail in Dhaka.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by bovinejoni on Tuesday August 05, 2025 @11:28AM (#44799269)
Being a Haitian immigrant is an immutable characteristic. That aside, these were legal immigrants welcomed by the city and assimilating into the community, used as a scapegoat with a baseless conspiracy to stir anger on a campaign trail. I’m not sure what about this incident is defensible but it has nothing to do with culture. Are you being intentionally provocative or do you really believe this?
Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by sofixa on Tuesday August 05, 2025 @03:07PM (#44802751)
> But Bangladesh isn’t the way it is because of Bangladeshis, and it’s “racist” to suggest that importing 50,000 Bangladeshis to an enclave in the US would recreate dynamics that prevail in Dhaka

And that's fine to say. However, it isn't acceptable to invent a story that these Bangladeshis are eating pets with the goal to get everyone else to hate them though, especially when the place in question actually majority likes them, and was even asking for extra resources to help them.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by bigyabai on Monday August 04, 2025 @05:22PM (#44791507)
They didn't ask you to define racism. They asked you to find sources for your claim, which you have conspicuously forgotten to include.

It's a public source too, so it doesn't cost you anything to support your claim. Are you recalling something that actually exists, or trying to warp the narrative into whatever supports your perception?

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Monday August 04, 2025 @06:06PM (#44791868)
> They didn't ask you to define racism

They raised the definition of racism by preemptively asserted that articles leveling “legitimate” accusations of racism wouldn’t count.

For example, here’s an article trying to tie Trump’s growing support among minorities to “multiracial whiteness” and minorities “embrac[ing] white power movements.” From where I’m standing that sure seems like calling minority supporters of Trump white supremacists.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Monday August 04, 2025 @08:15PM (#44792865)
[delayed]
Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by bigyabai on Tuesday August 05, 2025 @03:48PM (#44803351)
Aren't you supposed to be a Washington DC lawyer? How is it even fucking possible that you forgot what happened in January 2021? Were you in a coma when this was published? Were you get hit on the head in the ensuing years? It's incredulous that such recent history is so readily forgotten.

In case the context is lost on you (and I can't believe I'm explaining this), this article was published following a violent and lethal political protest endorsed by the president. If the NPR did not publish some sort of examination on that event, it would have been disgusting negligence on their behalf.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Wednesday August 06, 2025 @12:03AM (#44807512)
January 6 involved a multiracial band of wackjobs storming the capitol for reasons that had nothing to do with race or racism. Framing J6 as involving “multiracial white supremacy” is a great example NPR’s liberal bias. It has to make the story about white racism, even though it has nothing to do with racism.

There’s actually a real story here about race, which NPR won’t run. As racism in the country decreases, voting is becoming less racially polarized. Trump won the largest share of minorities of any republican in recent history, along with about half of foreign born voters. The GOP is becoming an increasingly multiracial party united by conspiracy theories and memes.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by jacquesm on Wednesday August 06, 2025 @04:56AM (#44809554)
> January 6 involved a multiracial band of wackjobs storming the capitol for reasons that had nothing to do with race or racism. Framing J6 as involving “multiracial white supremacy” is a great example of how NPR tries to make everything about white people being racist.

Yes, there are dumb people and there are even dumber people. Even the KKK ha(d/s) black people in it. But who needs the KKK when you can just join the republican party.

But let's see you determine the ratio of 'white people' (without saying whether they're racist or not) and people of color in this nice overview picture of the protests:

https://dims.apnews.com/dims4/default/5625233/2147483647/str...

I don't think that you're going to come to the conclusion that this was a 'multi racial band of wackjobs' and race and racism is more than likely a connecting factor between these people in spite of what you - against all available evidence - seem to want to continue to believe. A large majority of these people would most likely be happy to see you and your kids deported.

> In this case, NPR’s ideological blinders caused them to miss the real story.

It's not NPR whose ideological blinders caused them to miss the real story here.

> The GOP is becoming an increasingly multiracial coalition united by distrust of institutions and experts, conspiracy theories, and memes.

Experts are probably better to be trusted than distrusted. That includes such experts as Fauci and Powell.

Conspiracy theories are just tools to get people riled up over bullshit that pushes their emotional buttons. Meanwhile, it is not a conspiracy theory that a bunch of people went pretty much all-in on trying to destroy democracy in the USA and for some weird reason you are cheering them on.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Wednesday August 06, 2025 @08:50AM (#44811289)
> But let's see you determine the ratio of 'white people' (without saying whether they're racist or not) and people of color in this nice overview picture of the protests

A picture shows a group of mostly white people in a majority-white country. They must be connected by racism! Thank you for perfectly illustrating my point about the NPR mentality.

Also, the term “people of color” is more racist than anything that happened on J6 lol. It doesn’t reflect any anthropologically real concept, it’s simply propaganda created by democrats to promote an identity centered around supposed “oppression” to cultivate democratic political loyalty.

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by bigyabai on Wednesday August 06, 2025 @12:55PM (#44814570)
This is revisionist history and you clearly know you're wrong. There's no point in arguing with you if you're going to provide examples that you refuse to acknowledge in-context.

January 6th was a major event that was incited by the incumbent president, calling upon his most violent supporters. This went beyond "multiracial wackjobs" and included organized militias that existed for the sole purpose of starting a race war. You can validate these claims by looking up The Oath Keepers and Proud Boys in their own words. Here are a few direct quotes to help you get into the mind of the prosecution during the aftermath:

  Bobby Kinch: "Let’s just get this over! Race war, Civil, Revolution? Bring it! I’m about as fed up as a man can get!"

  Kyle Chapman: "We recognize that the West was built by the White Race alone and we owe nothing to any other race."

  Wendy Rogers: "the American people are being oppressed by Jewish tyrants."
The people there were insecure about being white. They wanted to support their president because they had more in common with racial identity than rule of law. If you cannot accept that explanation as a bar-certified lawyer, then I suggest you stop reading news altogether and save yourself the trouble of learning anything.
Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by rayiner on Wednesday August 06, 2025 @02:55PM (#44816105)
You can pick isolated examples from any political group. Here’s Obama with Louis Farrakhan: https://www.ajc.com/news/local/could-this-long-lost-photo-ha.... Look up what he said. Look up what elected Democrats in San Francisco have said about Asians: https://www.kqed.org/news/11896759/sf-school-board-member-al.... You’d think that, in the current climate, Democrats of all people would rethink the notion that pointing to some racists or antisemites in a crowd of people is somehow reflects on the whole crowd: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/09/nyregion/columbia-pro-pal...

But to circle back to the point. There’s no arguing with NPR listeners who insist that the Trump GOP, which won near-parity among Hispanics, nearly doubled its vote share among black people, and won 40% of asians, is meaningfully based on “racism.”[1] A meaningfully “racist” party does not lead to a decade of racial depolarization. If you have to come up with the concept of “multiracial whiteness” to reconcile your theory with the facts, that’s because your theory is a joke.

There’s myriad valid criticisms of Trump and the Trump GOP. But this one is painfully dumb, and it persists only because it feeds into a self-flattering white-savior narrative in which NPR listeners are enraptured.

[1] https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2025/06/26/behind-trump...

Re:Palantir Is Extending Its Reach Even Further into Government by sofixa on Tuesday August 05, 2025 @06:57AM (#44796543)
> or trying to warp the narrative into whatever supports your perception

We all know the answer to that question, unfortunately.