Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home from US

Re:Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home fro... by geoka9 on Monday June 23, 2025 @03:04PM (#44358966)

> In fact, even as the deals Russia offered got steadily worse they were always calibrated to be a better alternative than continuing to fight and lose.

They were always calibrated to be refused and there is a reason for that: NATO expansion is a red herring that Russia wants to use as an excuse for the invasion.

> There was nothing logical about Ukraine's decision to reject neutrality and to try and set itself up as a NATO military bulwark along Russia's most vulnerable border.

Ukraine has been neutral, and in fact quite friendly to Russia, both according to its Constitution and popular polls, up until the point Russia annexed a piece of its land and invaded another piece in 2014. By doing that Russia has shown that no promise of neutrality can save Ukraine from its tanks. I am surprised that some people are still talking about neutrality in good faith in 2025.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home fro... by justsomehnguy on Monday June 23, 2025 @04:01PM (#44359462)

Remind us why a purely defensive alliance lead by a country on the othrr side of a planet needs to be closer and closer to the borders of the country against which that alliance was created?

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home fro... by mopsi on Monday June 23, 2025 @04:33PM (#44359788)

It neither needs nor wants to be closer, and the long-standing rejection of Ukraine's membership application is a testament to that. Yet every neighbor of Russia is desperate to join it to secure themselves against yet another expansionist dictatorship in Russia.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home fro... by geoka9 on Monday June 23, 2025 @04:35PM (#44359802)

Because small countries of Europe that don't want to be invaded by Russia seek to join the alliance that was specifically created to prevent such eventuality for its members.

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Re:Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home fro... by NoOn3 on Monday June 23, 2025 @06:07PM (#44360689)

None of the last countries accepted into NATO had a real national referendum on joining.

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Re:Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home fro... by pydry on Monday June 23, 2025 @04:40PM (#44359846)

The alliance exists to attack, not defend.

That's why of the 4 wars it has taken part in in the last 30 years, 4 have been wars of aggression while 0 have been defensive (article 5 was invoked for 9/11 but occupying afghanistan wasnt a defensive move it was an imperial move).

It's a dog eat dog world out there for sure but sometimes the 14 year old boy isnt safer joining the crips for protection from the bloods. Sometimes he's just sacrificed as a pawn in a wider turf war as the crips' promises of protection ring hollow.

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Re:Germany and Italy pressed to bring $245B of gold home fro... by int_19h on Sunday June 29, 2025 @08:17PM (#44417882)

This is nonsense. The primary motivation for NATO is defense - the fact that it was not involved in defensive wars is rather evidence of its extreme effectiveness, being strong enough collectively that nobody even tries. OTOH countries not in it have been invaded (like Georgia and Ukraine).

[ Parent | on HN ]