News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Redis is open source again by rlpb on Thursday May 01, 2025 @07:10PM (#43864383)
Take a look at Debian’s philosophy: https://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines

This predates the OSI definition. The philosophy is about what empowers the user. Business models (or their challenges) have nothing to do with it.

It just so happens that empowering the user also empowers competitors.

Re:Redis is open source again by pabs3 on Thursday May 01, 2025 @09:19PM (#43865205)
The OSD is basically a copy of the DFSG btw
Re:Redis is open source again by amrocha on Thursday May 01, 2025 @11:27PM (#43865912)
You wouldn’t use the ten commandments as your only moral guide.

The landscape has changed. Google, Amazon, and microsoft are actively trying to destroy open source business models. Don’t let the leopards eat your face because you were too attached to your ideology.

Re:Redis is open source again by rlpb on Friday May 02, 2025 @08:41AM (#43868992)
> Don’t let the leopards eat your face because you were too attached to your ideology.

You're conflating ideologies. User-focused ideology doesn't care about business models. Leopards aren't eating their faces. They're perfectly fine where they are.

Business model focused ideology might care, but the AGPL exists and meets Debian's requirements. Those who care can choose to use it, or not, as they wish.

Re:Redis is open source again by palata on Friday May 02, 2025 @02:33AM (#43866788)
> It just so happens that empowering the user also empowers competitors.

IMHO copyleft licences are better for the user and permissive licences are better for competitors. Still people keep going with permissive licences.

Re:Redis is open source again by KingMob on Friday May 02, 2025 @03:04AM (#43866991)
Ehhh, Amazon offers a hosted Grafana service, which is AGPL. I'm not so sure that.
Re:Redis is open source again by palata on Friday May 02, 2025 @03:07AM (#43867007)
Which means that they have to share their changes to Grafana, doesn't it?
Re:Redis is open source again by pabs3 on Friday May 02, 2025 @03:22AM (#43867080)
The LWN thread says that they don't, but have separate proprietary licensing and co-marketing agreements with Grafana Labs.

https://lwn.net/Articles/1019686/#CommAnchor1019710

Re:Redis is open source again by palata on Friday May 02, 2025 @03:28AM (#43867111)
Thanks that interesting!

And in this case it means that it's not AGPL, but proprietary. Which kind of proves my point: they are apparently paying Grafana Labs to avoid the constraints of AGPL. If Grafana was permissive, they would surely not pay.

Re:Redis is open source again by KingMob on Monday May 05, 2025 @03:22AM (#43892643)
That's not what I'm getting at.

Amazon hosting Grafana means it's not only "permissive licences are better for competitors".

Copyleft licenses don't present obstacle to competitors that people seem to believe.