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Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by snarf21 on Monday March 17, 2025 @11:31AM (#43389600)
One question I had in college was if learning inhibits our ability to learn new things. We can gain knowledge but is that the same as learning? I'm not sure where the line sits between questioning and obstinance.

Looking back at Theranos, lots of "experts" (at Stanford, etc.) told her her idea was impossible given the small amount of blood but she convinced people she found a way. It was all a fraud but is there a way to do blood testing at that scale? Do we just need people to keep failing and see if anyone ever gets there? Should academia stick to things that aren't known to be "impossible"? I don't have any answers but find it interesting to contemplate.

Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by andrewflnr on Monday March 17, 2025 @11:34AM (#43389626)
Picking Theranos as an example in favor of ignoring conventional wisdom is really a bold choice. I know there are better examples, based on actual results instead of wishful thinking.
Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by fragmede on Monday March 17, 2025 @02:45PM (#43391562)
Avoiding more recent (aka controversial) examples, the best search engines of the early Internet required users to trawl through pages and pages of search results, with the useful answers on page 8 or so. Conventional wisdom was this was as good as it was gonna get, and that's just how search is. That was, of course, until Google came around and totally changed the game.
Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by plorkyeran on Monday March 17, 2025 @11:49AM (#43389793)
Your example of a time where ignoring the "experts" was a good thing was a time when the experts were correct?
Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by 9rx on Monday March 17, 2025 @11:54AM (#43389855)
Do you have a better example to set the context up to ask whether blood testing at that scale could ever become possible if enough people kept trying to crack that nut, contrary to the general consensus of infeasibility?
Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by andrewflnr on Monday March 17, 2025 @12:26PM (#43390178)
Why would you insist on framing a general discussion of the wisdom of defying conventional wisdom in terms of blood tests? Blood tests only come up in this context because of the one time someone lied about them.
Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by 9rx on Monday March 17, 2025 @12:29PM (#43390208)
You wouldn't. It has little to do with the general discussion. It was quite clearly posted as an aside.

It came up because the previous commenter was on a train of thought where the general topic lead him to think about Theranos, which lead him to think about blood testing in general and thus questions about that arose.

That is how discussions occur. If that slide into a new topic doesn't interest you, you don't need to reply.

Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by andrewflnr on Monday March 17, 2025 @01:45PM (#43390934)
Speaking of "don't need to reply", there are many times when I start writing a comment, realize that in fact it's wholly off topic, and delete it. Not every "train of thought" needs to be aired out.
Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by 9rx on Monday March 17, 2025 @02:04PM (#43391113)
No train of thought ever needs to be aired out. But at the same time, if you don't see that your questions are asked, how are you to ever know? Surely we are not anti-education types around here?

You are right that if you find yourself staring to make off-topic statements, like some of the earlier comments with their authors wanting to arbitrarily assert that they don't know how to read, it is time to go outside instead.

Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by thaumasiotes on Monday March 17, 2025 @03:10PM (#43391787)
Why would you need a better example? It's a very, very stupid question; asking it is not worthwhile.

This is the problem the experts pointed out:

If your sample is so small that a substance you're looking for isn't present at all, you will fail to detect that substance, even if it was present in the pool you drew your sample from.

Theranos claimed the reverse, that they could detect a substance whether it was present or not.

How much thought do you want to devote to the question of whether a different approach might realize that dream?

Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by 9rx on Tuesday March 18, 2025 @12:32AM (#43395779)
> It's a very, very stupid question; asking it is not worthwhile.

I, for one, learned something from your response, so clearly it was a great question and very much worthwhile. How did you manage to end up so horribly wrong?

It is funny how the seemingly well educated on HN hate education so much. A classic case of "I got mine"?

Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by thaumasiotes on Tuesday March 18, 2025 @02:00AM (#43396181)
What did you learn? How would education have helped?
Re:Undergraduate Disproves 40-Year-Old Conjecture, Invents N... by 9rx on Tuesday March 18, 2025 @02:10AM (#43396221)
> What did you learn?

1. More about Theranos. I've never given them attention in the past.

2. That you hate education (except maybe when it is your own).

> How would education have helped?

Once you get past the education level of somewhere around a five year old, meaning the education necessary to sustain basic life, does more ever really help in some kind of grand fashion? More education will sometimes allow you to stumble into desirable places, but exactly what education is beneficial to get there is random chance. It remains to be seen if this education will be a lucky break or just more to add to the useless pile, but either way does it really matter?