Please don't do this. I know it's frustrating, but it's against the site guidelines (more than one, actually) and only makes the threads worse.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Yes, ok, sorry dang. I promise to only post thoughtful comments that add value with the absolute minimum sprinkling of sarcasm. I do believe I'm trying to contribute to a diversity of opinion on HN and make arguments that others might not have encountered before, but I see that I've violated some of the rules. I've read and committed the guidelines to memory now. Can you please unthrottle me? It's hard to engage in substantive back-and-forth if I can't post more than a couple of times a day.

Ok, done!

Thank you!

I don't mind (and dang, I hope you don't mind me responding to this post.) I think many people tend to reflexively downvote things that seem contrarian or contradict what they know, and that it's probably generally a good thing. Lies My Teacher Told Me gets into some of the issues with the way American history is taught, and even though we recognize that the cherry tree story is a fable now, people are generally taught a mythologized view of Washington and the other founders in school, and that's partly the basis for our civic religion. So when you come across a comment like I wrote, I think it's easy to dismiss it. And that's by design! Even back then, people knew they were consciously creating a myth surrounding Washington and other figures. Take this letter from Benjamin Rush to John Adams:

> The venerable Charles Thompson now above 80 years of Age, now and then calls to see me. I once suggested to him to write secret Memoirs of the American Revolution. “No—No said he I will not.—I could not tell the truth without giving great offence. Let the World admire our patriots and heroes. Their supposed talents and Virtues (where they were <[. . .])> so) <will> by commanding invitation will serve the Cause of patriotism, and of Our Country.” I concur in this Sentiment, and therefore I earnestly request that you will destroy this letter [largely about Washington's failings] as soon as you read it. I do not even wish it to be known that General W: was deficient in that Mark of true Greatness which so preeminently characterized Julius Cæsar, Henry the 4th: of France, and Frederick the 2nd: of Prussia,—the talent to forgive.

https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Adams/99-02-02-5755

I think this is true of a lot of history, really - anything "important" we've assumed a mythologized view of, mediated by schools and Hollywood. Myth is more powerful than reality, so I think until you bury yourself in primary and contemporary sources, it can come across as almost conspiratorial. And of course, I am not saying that Rush, or the antifederalists, were correct in all their criticisms or all they said: only that Washington's comments must be understood contextually, and that's almost always missing when people refer to the Farewell Address, or at best they have a very simplified view of the situation that preserves the mythologization of Washington.