Nobody seems to actually believe in global warming. If they did, they wouldn't be advocating against Tesla in order to hurt Musk. If you actually believe in global warming, you wouldn't let your hatred for Musk hurt any company that is helping our fight against global warming.

Tesla isn't needed. EVs are happening with or without Tesla. They're not even very good EVs compared to the competition.

That's really not the point. Not everyone is paying attention, ANY messaging at all that dissuades the public from going EV instead of ICE is actively harmful. Anyone advocating against Tesla is letting their emotions hurt the fight against global warming. And the only explanation I can come up with, is that they don't actually believe in global warming. Because if they did, they would swallow their anger, and favor every measure that advances the fight against global warming.

> the only explanation I can come up with

Maybe you should think about it a while longer. Or find a friend who's better at coming up with ideas to help.

There are about a zillion other explanations. Maybe they think that "ANY messaging that encourages EVs dissuades the public from going public transport" and that's harmful. Maybe they see other EV makers as preferable to Tesla. Maybe they care deeply about global warming but just as you said, are letting their anger get in the way of that goal. Maybe they see the immediate harms of Musk's policies as a more urgent problem than climate change.

There's a tremendous leap between "Not supporting Tesla because of Musk" and climate denialism.

> There's a tremendous leap between "Not supporting Tesla because of Musk" and climate denialism.

Not really. Because it doesn't matter if you choose to support an alternative EV maker. If you actively campaign against Tesla you are hurting EV sales. There are Tesla's built today that should be purchased instead of ICE vehicle. Anything you do that stops someone else (even if you're not going to buy them yourself) is actively hurting the fight against global warming.

The only reason you would hurt the fight against global warming, is that you don't think it's as important as your reason for hating Musk. And that's a form of denialism. You're denying (if only to yourself) that climate change is going to cause death and destruction.

Godwin answer: Hitler was a vegan who treated animals well. If you’re against Hitler, you’re an animal abuser.

Banning cars entirely would help global warming more than encouraging people to use EVs.

There is nothing internally inconsistent about weighing the pros and cons and deciding what measures are and aren't worth the benefit considering the drawbacks.

> Anyone advocating against Tesla is letting their emotions hurt the fight against global warming

The capitalist class is driving climate change. If hurting one of the capitalist's brands by criticizing its CEO is the difference between success and failure in the fight against global warming, then the fight is already lost.

BTW, we're not going to consume our way out of global warming. We should be getting away from a two cars in every driveway culture if we're going to get serious about addressing the climate emergency.

Musk is currently fighting to further global warming. Sitting Congress members are, as we speak, being denied access to EPA headquarters as he dismantles the organization. I live in Washington DC, every government employee who works on anything vaguely environmental is preparing to be fired (or has been already). References to climate change have been scrubbed from nearly every government website. His deputies are currently inside NOAA, and the soon-to-be OMB director was a primary author of Project 2025 which calls for NOAA to be dismantled. He is tacitly supporting America's withdrawal from the Paris Agreement, which is about to cause a domino effect of other countries quitting ("why should we commit to anything if the richest country in the world isn't going to").

It is not counterproductive to not want to financially support this person. He has already declared he's going to end EV subsidies, a much more damaging move than a theoretical handful of people deciding not to buy an EV, and he has repeatedly shown that the only thing he cares about is money. The majority party in Congress is not going to stop him, the president is not going to stop him, the only thing that will stop him is the prospect of losing money.

I mean if you believe that a well run government is more important than global warming you make a choice.

... you call what we're seeing "well run" ? Like, really?

I’m saying why would you support Musk if you prioritize a well run government?

Got it, we are on the same page.

> ANY messaging at all that dissuades the public from going EV

It isn't about messaging. It's what the current administration (which Musk is a part of) is doing.

This article is about the current administration stopping funding for EV chargers.

> Not everyone is paying attention

Yes. You should start paying attention. If you're serious about the fight against global warming, if you truly believe it's an existential threat, then you can no longer buy Tesla.

Tesla is the ONLY profitable EV company.

Not true at all. There are several profitable Chinese EV companies, and if you're only talking about cars available in the US for some reason, Stellantis and GM are making money on their EVs. And obviously Ford, Hyundai, Chevrolet, etc. are profitable overall.

I suppose the word "profitable" is open to some interpretation, but I stand by what I said above. I will not bother to cite the numerous financial reports about many of the companies you've mentioned, losing significant amounts of money on each EV sold. In some cases, the losses have been staggering.

One example: In 2024, the Ford Lightning was produced at a loss of $132,000 per vehicle.

https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/ford-lost-1...

For now. They're also a good number of years ahead of most of them.. in finance and software.

Hyundai built a US factory to get the tax credit, so Elmo is trying to get rid of it. We will see how profitable Tesla is as sales are dropping massively all over the world.

No True Scotsman fallacy. You're declaring that people aren't true scotsmen (believers in climate change) if they advocate against Tesla because the leader of that company is causing significant geopolitical harm.

If Tesla is harmed, then mindshare/marketshare/investment can simply migrate to other companies.

It's not that easy... there is inertia, investment, mindshare and messaging. What some fraction of the public will hear, no matter how clear your messaging, is not Fuck Tesla, they will hear, Global Warming isn't that big a deal.

You are literally saying that hurting Musk is more important than the fight against global warming. That sends the wrong message. And you would only be willing to send that message if you don't truly believe that climate change is an existential threat.

Nobody complains about how shitty the landlord is when their apartment is on fire, they just get busy putting out the fire and protecting their family and property.

> What some fraction of the public will hear, no matter how clear your messaging, is not Fuck Tesla, they will hear, Global Warming isn't that big a deal.

They're already getting that when the leader of Tesla is in bed with the political party that denies climate change. You're also comparing a theoretical harm with an active and ongoing one.

Two wrongs do not make a right.

All my arguments hold even if Musk and Trump are the devil incarnate. In fact, they may be the devil that convinces people to take their eye off the ball of climate change. They are exploiting people's emotions and hatred to do damage to the fight against climate change.

It doesn't matter what Musk Tweets, It doesn't matter how shitty Trump is. If you use that as an excuse to do anything less that 100% of what you can to help in the fight against climate change, then you are a climate change denier who doesn't really believe we're in a fight for our lives.

I can just buy a Rivian? I know nothing of RJ Scaringe's political views, and it feels excellent.

His political views don't matter, actions are what matter. As long as you know he isn't using your money to buy the United States government and remove the EPA, you can feel confident that your purchase will not be counterproductive.

Nothing Elon says or does aligns with Tesla's master plan anymore. I can take my money elsewhere until their crony-filled board does the needful and dumps him. Rivian R2 is going to be amazing.

Everyone has a priority stack. Given a choice between the immediate threat of Musk and the dismantling of the federal government and supporting Musk and fighting global warming, the choice is clear.

Exactly. We're surrounded by closeted climate change deniers who don't actually believe the results of climate change will be catastrophic.

What does it cost anyone to support Tesla, or at least stay quiet about any opposition you feel toward them? Nothing. But people are so emotional that they'd rather speak out against Tesla than swallow their anger. And the only explanation for that, is they do not really believe in climate change.

> or at least stay quiet about any opposition you feel toward them?

Good grief. Can you hear yourself? Can you see what you're writing?

This bizarre weak submissiveness is exactly how you end up with an autocratic state.

This reads like a result of someone wondering "What happens if sovereign citizens did climate science?"

> Nobody seems to actually believe in global warming.

The administration Musk is part of sure doesn't. It is halting permits for renewable energy projects and stopping funding for EV chargers:

https://apnews.com/article/wind-energy-offshore-turbines-tru...

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/5105492-trump-...

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c20px1e05w0o

If you actually believe in global warming then you can longer buy Tesla.

> you wouldn't let your hatred for Musk hurt any company that is helping our fight against global warming.

Your bizarrely submissive attitude won't save the planet. You can submit to Musk if it helps you. No one else should.

There are plenty of other EVs to choose from. Buy one of those.

> Again 4C here we come.

There is a plan for that, take more land up north, e.g. Canada and Greenland.

I actually think this is a plan to get rare earth resources.

I also think that it is an obviously extreme position that then will then obviously fail, but then the United States will fall back to "Canada and Greenland can only sell rare earth rights to the United States" to lock China out.

I heard that Trump is refashioning the CIA to focus on the West, which could be understood as including a focus Canada. I can sort of imagine the turbulence we may start to see in Canada's political realm as a result of such shift of the CIA's priorities and operations to Canada in the service of achieving Trump's goals:

> "His aide said Trump’s CIA will have a greater focus on the western hemisphere, targeting countries not traditionally considered adversaries of the US, according to the Journal."

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/05/cia-reported...

He has sold us out to Russia and this tracks with that.

Ahhh

So now I see why we’re demanding Greenland!

I guess that’s just planning ahead.

/s

Here is a strategy doc from a reputable org that explicitly states that climate change is one of the causes of an increased view of Greenland as a strategic asset: https://www.belfercenter.org/research-analysis/explainer-geo...

4C?

4°C global average temperature increase above preindustrial levels.

I have time to protest but I don't really see the point right now. I participated in the largest protests I've ever seen in 2017 and they accomplished nothing. Everybody with the power to do something about this at the moment blatantly does not give a shit and has already said so publicly.

Organize your colleagues. Labor has more power than general public protestors

I work for a small company trying to reduce emissions so none of my colleagues need convincing. I am still organizing action on climate change outside of work, I just don't feel particularly hopeful about it right now.

You mean “labor” where many support Trump and voted for him?

I'm of the opinion that youth protests (of any kind) for niche complaints (basically anything that your normie voter can't really get behind) only strengthens the executive. Protests are a great way to hook up and feel good, but I don't believe it moves the needle. Trump loves protests.

No one knows what the NEVCP is/or does. When Trump threatens Social Security payments (which he won't), then the People will rise up. In the meantime, enjoy the time off from work/school, the spring weather is lovely.

This sounds more like a monopoly play to give Tesla a continuing advantage with it's charging network vs. an anti-EV stance.