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Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by somenameforme on Monday February 03, 2025 @12:11AM (#42915193)
Not to be the one to point out the pink elephant, but the Hugo Awards became somewhat politicized a decade or so ago and identity politics started to feature heavily into selections. If your criteria doesn't include that then the awards are now probably meaningless. But go back to the past, and there's a reason they used to have such prestige associated with them. For instance in the 60s some winners were Starship Troopers, Man in the High Castle, Stranger in a Strange Land, Dune, and The Moon is a Harsh Mistress!

Come to think of it not sure if that says more about the 60s or the award though. Cripes there was something in the water back then.

Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by watwut on Monday February 03, 2025 @07:54AM (#42917720)
Yes, 60s famous as period when the gender of the author or characters did not mattered in the slightest. It was totally only later when they started to matter, sure.
Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by kurisufag on Monday February 03, 2025 @08:43AM (#42918129)
identity politics sneakily becoming a required element in media (whether that be for genuine representation reasons, appeals to that market, whatever) isn't a necessary result of equitability in writing.
Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by watwut on Monday February 03, 2025 @04:15PM (#42923252)
Compared to era when female characters and writers were excluded openly ... I mean common.

It is absurd to use the era where identity (gender, race) was key determinant of what will happen, before anything else.

Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by machomaster on Tuesday February 04, 2025 @06:25AM (#42931009)
Do you have any evidence that such alleged exclusion of good writing was common and disproportional compared to male writers?
Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by somenameforme on Monday February 03, 2025 @09:22AM (#42918462)
Of course it mattered, but it didn't define the results. Le Guin won it multiple times. And as far back as 1956, the third Hugo ever, a female author made it to the short list. But they weren't winning or being nominated because of their sex. They were just exceptional authors who happened to be female, which is as it should be.
Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by watwut on Monday February 03, 2025 @04:13PM (#42923221)
Meanwhile male authors had to be less exceptional to win or succeed. Simple as that. Men had lower bar, every step of the way.

Also, claim that hugo winners won only because of their gender is crap. They won't the vite fairly. Unlike sad puppies, they did not even needed politically motivated coordination for that.

Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by somenameforme on Monday February 03, 2025 @11:53PM (#42928149)
What authors of the past were neglected in your opinion, or perhaps unfairly promoted? In modern times I think this is fairly easy to demonstrate. Books like Project Hail Mary are insufficient to win, while the most winning works are not especially exceptional. Those that are, perhaps The Three Body Problem, tend be the exception rather than the rule.

The vote also is not fair. People publicly organize voting cliques on e.g. Reddit (to say nothing of what's happening in private), and the new system is extremely exploitable. But I think that's beside the point. The issue is the outcome. The Hugos used to not only reliably reflect the best in genre works, but also select works that would often be talked about decades later. How they achieved that is irrelevant, only that they used to be able to do so, and now do not.

I think the groups that coopt, or try to coopt, these sort of things (which obviously also includes the Puppy stuff), fail to realize that the prestige of something is not based on that thing itself - but on the value of that which it promotes. If MIT just started enrolling 'merely above average' students and printing out diplomas, then they'd quickly lose their prestige. The same thing has happened here.

Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by nicolas_t on Tuesday February 04, 2025 @08:14AM (#42931885)
I mean Project Hail Mary is also far from being exceptional. I didn't dislike the book and it was enjoyable but I would never think it deserves an award. In particular, the scenes with the alien fell really flat. Now I haven't read the winner for best novel of 2022 and to be honest I haven't read any amazing novel published in 2021.
Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by somenameforme on Tuesday February 04, 2025 @09:17AM (#42932601)
Of course there are personal tastes, so I'd simply look at large scale data. The winner for 2022 is A Desolation Called Peace. [1] As per Amazon it ended up with far fewer purchases, lower reviews amongst those who purchased it (in spite of a rather conspicuous amount of reviews that are generally critical of the book then giving it 5 stars anyhow), and it won the Hugo.

Of course the Hugo obviously shouldn't just be "#1 book [in genre] on Amazon" because the entire point of awards is to focus on quality, which may not always be clearly reflected by sales. But when even the relatively small minority of people buying the winning book don't seem to like it as much as other books, something is quite wrong. Let alone the fact that Project Hail Mary came in last place, also behind books like She Who Became the Sun. [2]

[1] - https://www.amazon.com/Desolation-Called-Peace-Teixcalaan-Bo...

[2] - https://www.amazon.com/She-Who-Became-Shelley-Parker-Chan-eb...

Re:Don't make fun of renowned author Dan Brown (2013) by edanm on Monday February 10, 2025 @09:56AM (#43001014)
FWIW, A Desolation Called Peace is one of my favorite SF books I've read in the last 10 years. I really enjoy that series.

I like Project Hail Mary, too, and it's certainly more popular because the author is far more well known, but there's no question in my mind which one is "better", certainly in terms of deserving to win an award.