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Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by pkulak on Thursday January 09, 2025 @02:19AM (#42642583)
You can’t give someone only two options, one less bad, then claim there was a free choice made.
Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by wtcactus on Thursday January 09, 2025 @04:44AM (#42643536)
Yes, getting into prison after you committed a crime and were condemned for it, is usually not a free choice.
Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by s1artibartfast on Thursday January 09, 2025 @12:39PM (#42647943)
Totally agree. Once you are in prison, choosing to work or not is a free choice.
Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by bdangubic on Thursday January 09, 2025 @02:47PM (#42649208)
Thirteenth Amendment, Section 1:

“Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, EXCEPT as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.”

Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by s1artibartfast on Thursday January 09, 2025 @04:00PM (#42649762)
In the context of firefighting, my understanding it is entirely voluntary and selective as well
Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by dragonwriter on Thursday January 09, 2025 @01:02PM (#42648199)
> Once you are in prison, choosing to work or not is a free choice.

It is literally not in California (though which work, within bounds that differ by prisoner, may be), and California this year defeated a ballot proposition which would have made your claim true.

Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by wtcactus on Thursday January 09, 2025 @02:44PM (#42649178)
The free choice is to whether commit or not the crime that puts you in prison. After that, until you pay your debt to society, the free choices are over.
Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by s1artibartfast on Thursday January 09, 2025 @10:47AM (#42646771)
Sure you can. That is every choice in life.
Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by pkulak on Thursday January 09, 2025 @11:10AM (#42646992)
When you're put in prison, your "freedom is taken". We use that language for a reason. It's what happens, it's intentional, and I used to think everyone understood what it meant. Choices in prison are not the same as "every choice in life".
Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by s1artibartfast on Thursday January 09, 2025 @12:38PM (#42647937)
I don't disagree with what you said, but I don't think that supports the conclusion above.

Trade-offs are different in all sorts of situations. All choices in life have consequence. The fact that one is better than the other does not negate anything or create slavery

Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by pkulak on Friday January 10, 2025 @12:42AM (#42652903)
So nothing can be slavery if there's any choice at all? By that logic slavery can never exist, because any slave can chose not to work and be killed, kill themselves, run, etc.

At some point you have to draw a line and say, there is choice, but there's not enough choice to say it's not slavery.

Re:LA wildfires force thousands to evacuate, NASA JPL closed by s1artibartfast on Friday January 10, 2025 @10:33AM (#42656510)
Sure. I think for the case of firefighting, where there is no punishment or consequences whatsoever, it is an easy call.