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Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by scotty79 on Sunday November 03, 2024 @11:58PM (#42038602)
> any graduate student with a clipboard can demonstrate that reasonable-seeming people are often totally irrational

And yet, mainstream theories of economy assume that individuals are reasonable actors successfully and efficiently acting in their own self-interest.

Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by mr_toad on Monday November 04, 2024 @12:18AM (#42038714)
> And yet, mainstream theories of economy assume that individuals are reasonable actors successfully and efficiently acting in their own self-interest.

They really don’t. In the context of this discussion it’s quite ironic that this myth is so widespread.

Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by scotty79 on Monday November 04, 2024 @12:24AM (#42038741)
This myth is basically a tenet of popular capitalism. It's as spread as the belief in capitalism itself.
Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by titannet on Monday November 04, 2024 @12:33AM (#42038788)
Even the US is fairly far away from theoretical capitalism.. "No barriers to market entry" - ever seen that one in practice?
Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by scotty79 on Monday November 04, 2024 @07:25AM (#42040909)
I think in US barriers of entry are lower. I've seen a video about a software developer in US that lived in the neighborhood where garbage collection company wanted to charge extra for getting out of the truck and emptying the trash bins.

This guy basically told their neighbors that he can provide same service they used to have at the same rate, collected orders and bought random used "smaller" (but still quite large) garbage truck with robotic hand to pick up the bins.

In Europe without special driving license for trucks he wouldn't be able to drive it (it weighed above 3.5T). I'm assuming other kinds of licenses are also required to ensure the collected garbage is disposed of properly.

In many places garbage collection is a service that's ordered through the local government so that the prices can be kept similar for everybody so that people from remote places (who'd need to pay more for collection) won't just toss their garbage into the forests and such.

Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by andrewflnr on Monday November 04, 2024 @12:07AM (#42038659)
Somewhat famously, people do get more rational when money is on the line. Not homo economicus rational, but a little more connected to reality. Usually this is interpreted cynically.
Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by nitwit005 on Monday November 04, 2024 @12:04AM (#42038636)
You're going to struggle to find any economist who agrees with the concept that everyone is acting rationally.
Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by analog31 on Monday November 04, 2024 @12:36AM (#42038808)
I would call it a zero-order approximation.

We all "know" that people behave irrationally, yet studies that attempt to demonstrate systematically irrational behaviors end up producing weak or irreproducible results. Or, the studies uncover rational behaviors that the researchers didn't expect.

Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by scotty79 on Monday November 04, 2024 @07:18AM (#42040873)
Do you have some studies where unexpected rationality was discovered?
Re:Why Facts Don't Change Our Minds by analog31 on Monday November 04, 2024 @08:06AM (#42041159)
The one I remember is about "loss aversion" where it turned out that people were making reasonable choices, but not ones based on the simplistic probabilities that the researchers had designed for their experimental method. Another one is the "marshmallow test" where it turns out that some children have a reason to not trust adults. I don't have detailed references or anything like that.