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Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by geokon on Friday September 06, 2024 @10:39PM (#41471148)
How does this compare to something like A-Frame?

It feels like all the VR platforms are quite locked down and funneling users to app stores - so if you want something simple and not performant then a framework that works through the browser would in theory get traction more easily

Tangentially, I also always quite liked the idea of webpages being VR spaces. Has more of a "metaverse" vibe to it

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by dartos on Saturday September 07, 2024 @02:34AM (#41471932)
You’d be surprised how standardized the VR world is.

At least for pcvr and quest, the OpenXR standard seems to be well adopted

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by dale_glass on Saturday September 07, 2024 @05:23AM (#41472704)
If you want something not locked down, try ours! -- https://overte.org/

We're a non-profit, and our code is entirely under the Apache License. Not only nothing is monetized, but the architecture is extremely monetization-unfriendly, and we ripped out what little there was in the original code. Oddly enough the codebase was built by a company with commercial ambitions (High Fidelity), but unsurprisingly failed to make any money.

So we picked that up and are continuing development.

So if you want freedom, I believe we're at the top of the list. Everything is open, nothing is centralized. Not even accounts are required. You can just easily set this up on your own hardware with no outside dependencies and do whatever you want.

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by thetoon on Saturday September 07, 2024 @04:42PM (#41476351)
Wasn't Vircadia also derived from High Fidelity?
Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by dale_glass on Sunday September 08, 2024 @03:54AM (#41478891)
Yeah, the line goes High Fidelity -> Vircadia -> Overte (where most devs are)

Vircadia started off well, but then the lead decided to go all in on crypto. Pretty much everyone just left and made a new project, while Vircadia as far as I can tell has almost no development going on. Or if there's anything it's not public.

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by thetoon on Sunday September 08, 2024 @05:03PM (#41483195)
Great news! Do you know if overte also intends to fork the (upcoming) web client?
Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by dale_glass on Sunday September 08, 2024 @05:47PM (#41483515)
Currently, probably not. We've got plenty of other things to work on including several big projects some of which have a deadline needed to satisfy a grant (thanks NLnet Foundation!), and we looked into the web functionality and were unimpressed.

Vircadia's web functionality technically works, and I think it's an okay effort for the tiny team that remains, but it's really at the proof of concept stage. It's slow, misses a whole lot of functionality including very basic things, and has extremely obvious bugs like falling through the floor and the camera getting stuck easily.

So far our take is that it's too broken to just merge as-is, somebody would need to have at least some interest in fixing it up a bit. And for the time being there isn't, and on Vircadia's side the development of it slowed down dramatically.

It's not impossible in the future, but so far things just don't line up right. And it'd be a huge project. The web client is its own thing written from scratch, it'd be an enormous amount of work to make it half as functional as the desktop one.

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by thetoon on Monday September 09, 2024 @02:40AM (#41486010)
Sounds fair, though I had hopes for such a client (at least something to just check out on the virtual world state without spinning up a whole desktop client).

Since you seem rather active with the project, do you know whether openxr is on the roadmap, or if you're stuck with openvr for the foreseeable future?

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by dale_glass on Monday September 09, 2024 @10:52AM (#41489066)
> Sounds fair, though I had hopes for such a client (at least something to just check out on the virtual world state without spinning up a whole desktop client).

Even that would take some work. We've made a few improvements to the core code that Vircadia didn't and that would involve adapting the web client code to match.

I'm also worried about the effects it could have on the project. Will people start demanding that it be fixed now? What about when there's a security issue found in it? Will there be drama with Vircadia?

Merging the code means taking on a responsibility, and at the very least we'd have to properly review it and make sure it's good enough people are going to want to work on it.

So far I believe that this has to approached with some good planning and somebody willing to work on that code to account for any problems that might arise. So it'd help a lot if anybody was interested in maintaining the code.

> Since you seem rather active with the project, do you know whether openxr is on the roadmap, or if you're stuck with openvr for the foreseeable future?

Good news! It's been in the works for a while, and a PR for OpenXR was opened 5 days ago: https://github.com/overte-org/overte/pull/1129

If you're interested in testing that, you're welcome to give it a try. If you need any help getting started, we have Matrix, Discord and an in-world meeting in 5 hours from the time of this post.

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by immortalxgr on Saturday September 07, 2024 @11:38AM (#41474503)
For openness and simplicity look no further. LOVR is written in C with a hand-built Vulkan engine, and you script your games/apps in Lua. It's that simple. No app-stores, no subscriptions, no web technologies/browsers. You can have a VR "Hello World" in 3 lines of code.
Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by shatsky on Saturday September 07, 2024 @07:03PM (#41476976)
Not a VR expert, but it seems to be about same thing for OpenXR+Vulkan as A-frame is for WebXR+WebGL. Minimalist 3D engine with simple API wrapping much more complex lower level APIs, "reducing number of things which can be done in exchange for making some things easy to do with it". Native, not web app.

OpenXR is "Vulkan for VR" by the way, every major HMD vendors runtime supports it. Though only SteamVR supports Linux, and there's mess with support of advanced tech like asynchronous reprojection, I hope Monado which is "Mesa for VR" will succeed. And Firefox gets WebXR.

Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by wkat4242 on Saturday September 07, 2024 @11:38PM (#41478026)
Yeah Linux VR gaming isn't there yet. Especially if you have a quest and need to stream over WiFi. I'm still running a Windows PC for that.
Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by thetoon on Monday September 09, 2024 @02:41AM (#41486015)
For what it's worth, after years of (occasionally) trying to get ALVR working, I've had a surprisingly fast success with WiVRn.
Re:LÖVR – An open source framework for rapidly building imme... by wkat4242 on Saturday September 07, 2024 @11:37PM (#41478019)
I don't think this is browser based. Which is pretty good because in my understanding there's a significant performance penalty with WebXR.