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Re:Why do people believe true things? by saghm on Saturday August 17, 2024 @09:32PM (#41279454)
Agreed, that was the weirdest part of the article for me. Given that the example of "why is there poverty?" was given as coming from a child in school, I think the author also is misunderstanding what the question even was by using a definition of "poverty" that's defined entirely by modern standards and applying it historically. If a child asked that question, telling them "it's the default state because back 1000 years ago even royalty were poor by our standards" doesn't help them understand what they actually wanted to know, which is "why do some people have a less money than others?". This isn't a uniquely modern phenomenon (although the exact distribution over time of course isn't static). Reframing the question based on an academic definition of "poverty" might be technically correct, but it's not helpful in the context it was asked.

Ironically, the author seems quite smug about knowing better, saying "It is a childish question, one which betrays a naive, uninformed understanding of economics and history". It seems more like they betrayed a naive, uninformed understanding of children to so grossly miss the point of what they were actually asking. If their reaction to an intellectually curious child is to dunk on them for not precisely framing their question according to academic definitions of terms, it's not surprising that they think "ignorance and misrepresentations" are the "default state of humanity".

Re:Why do people believe true things? by didgetmaster on Saturday August 17, 2024 @10:23PM (#41279654)
My definition of poverty has been that you do not have enough money to meet the basic needs of yourself and your family if you have one. It is not just because you have less than others.
Re:Why do people believe true things? by saghm on Saturday August 17, 2024 @11:23PM (#41279917)
I don't disagree with you, but from my reading the article's definition is entirely impossible to reconcile with this:

> The reason is that nothing is puzzling about poverty. It is humanity's default state. Until very recently, everyone lived in what would now be regarded as shocking poverty. Even the elites—monarchs, aristocrats, and so on—lived in conditions that were appalling relative to the prosperity enjoyed by most people in affluent societies today.

This is what I meant by the author reframing the question to the point where it feels like they completely missed the point. Your definition would be totally compatible with the way I think a child asking "why is there poverty?" is using the word, but I don't see how anyone could argue that "the elites—monarchs, aristocrats, and so on" were completely unable to meet their needs at any point before between the years 1-1500 CE, which the author describes as this:

> The long, flat line that characterises most of human history? That is poverty: crushing, subsistence-level, Malthusian poverty.