This is true. I for one do all my computing with a goofy grin on my face, while riding a unicycle.

In all seriousness, this product will be perfect for me. The lower weight will help with my unicycling, and the 4-core i7 will look great with my butterfly wings.

Since the overwhelming bulk of computer users(including pro users) have no interest in fiddling with their computer specs post purchase, Apple are simply making a product that fits the market.

I'm not going to go into the historical precedence of laptops having limited upgradability, but as you've noted something had to give, and soldering the RAM is by no means a new idea.

No one here is saying we tear down our laptops and assemble them back three times a day. But if something like a RAM gets toast on my machine, I would like to get that replaced instead of replacing the whole machine.

Why, you might ask. Its because it works out cheaper that way. And besides, I don't throw away my car if some thing little goofs up! Why should I throw away my computer.

Historically, Apple tends to be pretty good on support worth the price. If something like a RAM chip is toast, they'll usually replace the board, or even the whole machine.

The truth is that you can take your apple product into any apple store, or apple certified reseller worldwide and get the same level of replace or repair. The only difference is timing, Apple stores keep a limited stock of parts, while resellers must order them in. The difference in repair time works out to be a few days.

I'm told that the next day, he went to the store and they gave him a new, top-of-the-line 15" Unibody MacBook Pro with all his data preloaded on it. I have no way of proving that this thing actually has happened (but no reason to believe my friend was lying; as he's a respected and very honest man). This is not what always happens, but Apple is rich, and they know if they treat their customers well, they'll be customers again AND all their relatives & friends would be tempted to try Macs if they knew they could get a royal support like that. So, it's not a philanthropic thing, they do it for their business, but as they're very rich they are more generous than other manufacturers.

And just one other anecdote: another friend of mine's MacBook Pro died suddenly (no AppleCare either). Sent it to an Apple Store and they changes motherboard, RAMs and HDD free of charge.

Yes, pretty much. And "genius" have a lot of leeway in their handling of people coming in. They generally seem expected to try and make customers happy as much as they can, and I regularly see comments about completely unreasonable replacements allowed by apple stores.

All of the computers have been updated post purchase. I've put more RAM into iMacs, more RAM and SSDs into MBPs, and Mac Pros got more RAM, video cards, SSDs, HDDs etc.

In fact, one of the very first things I do is buy more RAM for my MBPs because it is more economical to do it yourself. Then if you wait 2 years, you can again double your RAM for extremely low price.

If Apple were making only this harder because of physical design constraints, you would have a point. But they are also artificially constraining the OS to make it more appliance like, and less and less UNIX like. But that's OK. Most of the users wouldn't know UNIX from eunuchs anyway.

While that is historically true, it's not really the case for the new MBP: the 16GB RAM update costs $200, 2x8GB sticks cost ~150 at crucial. Meh.

> Then if you wait 2 years, you can again double your RAM for extremely low price.

Unless the chipset is at its physical limits, which is usually the case if you upgraded the RAM once on purchase.

2x8GB is ~$150. 2x4GB is ~$50[1].

Apple is charging $200 for a $100 bump in component costs. 100% markup is excessive.

[1] http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233...

We nerds need to accept that we ate not apple's focus anymore. Just spec your machine high, pony up lots of money, enjoy the shit out of it.

Anymore? It's never been Apple's focus

2x8GB SODIMM kit at crucial, $150.

Yes, extorsion is exactly the word I'd have used in this position, indeed.

CORSAIR 16GB for MacBook Pro - $89.99

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233...

The elitism here is just disgusting.

I suppose all the graphic designers, photographers, programmers, and even just plain old novice users who love Apple products should just pack their bags and go back to pencils and paper. After all, if they're not doing any kind of serious computing, we really ought not cater to their needs, wants, or desires.

Computers are obviously only for people running batch processes with 95%+ CPU and I/O utilization.

Apple is trying very hard to convert a computer into a washing machine. Which is, giving it a specific use, like a TV or a refrigerator and tightly controlling everything behind that use.

There was a period back when computers were around 16Mhz that you could reliably keep a machine for many years and progressively upgrade it. The speed of progress has increased significantly since then, it's unlikely that you'll be able to find appropriate hardware for your machine by the time software has rendered it obsolete.

To break up the argument a bit:

- Soldered ram doesn't devalue the product, or present a less serious computer user. It reflects the reality that most people don't upgrade. This forum will definitely have a skew towards tinkerers, but it's not representative of the market, and there are already a slew of products to serve this consumer. - If it's broken outside of warranty there are indeed many avenues for low cost repair, even though this has a small chance of even occurring. - The cost of maxing out the ram is on par with market pricing. - Giving the user upgrade choices at purchase time is a better route than trying to hunt down parts later on. All computers become obsolete, minor spec upgrades won't stop this.

This is what incremental change looks like, ram being a quick solution for computing woes has reached the point of irrelevancy and 16GB of ram is certainly appropriate for the gamut of uses of such a device. Most speed gains experienced on this hardware will be the result of the SSD.

But no way in the world would I like to throwaway a washing machine if something small went wrong inside it. That's where the tinkering part comes to play. I don't mind the knobs and dials, but claiming that not having user serviceable parts is not a requisite of usability gets really very difficult to believe in.

Yeah,... Astro-Physicist here. 90% of my colleagues use Macs and we write most of the software that controls satellites and earth bound observatories on Macs.

Just an old science, entertainment, with no real or useable results :o).

How many people expect to compile and run stuff on their iPad? None, but it's a perfectly capable machine, more powerful than PCs of the 90s.

That (and related stuff) is what I mean when I write ( a bit further down) that there is no real operating system for a Thinkpad. Pity.

In a way, apple goes the same way that car manufacturers have gone already. Try to get a BMW repaired in a non-BMW workshop. Impossible, because you need BMW proprietary tools and Software. So BMW dictates the prices and they dictate, what parts have to be replaced for a certain error.

My wife and I use subway and bicycles where ever we can, since Mercedes, Porsche, Opel, Ford all try to do the same.

Factory basic service information is not only easily available, it's free (at least in the US: they make you provide a US CC every 365 days for online access, so it might be MB-USA funding it, but the card is not charged). Parts are readily available aftermarket, from OE and non-OE suppliers. There's also several well-respected third party shops within a few miles of here.

I don't drive a BMW, but I know of two excellent (but not cheap) third party shops nearby.

Yes, some systems are computer-augmented for service, and require a beyond-OBD2 level of software, but that software is available (and a couple thousand dollars, a lot for an individual, but nothing compared to the rest of the tools a shop has to have).

I am quite happy with the supportability MB provides, and probably wouldn't drive one if your statement above matched my experience.

Side note: it's a pleasure to work on MB: very few "one time" fasteners (like those plastic Christmas tree push things, or ridiculously fragile/undersized plastic latches). Thing that you need to take apart are designed to be taken apart and put back together many times without damage or leaving ill-fitting parts afterward. You really notice the difference when servicing someone else's other brand, price-optimized car.

As a bottom line, workshops that can service cars with new production date vanish.

What you say is indeed the solution that came into my mind: buy a cool oldtimer (I especially like the Porsche 911 from the late 70s/early 80s) and buy a new house with a large garage. Tools are available already.

The computer in front of me is basically just an appliance now. That has no bearing on the actual work I do.

Um, you missed the last line of the post you replied to.

Last I checked typing text files and compiling them is more serious than most users and doesn't require massive clusters to accomplish.

Look at iPad. It's more powerful than PCs of the 90s yet no one even expects to run their custom code on it. This is where Macs and OS X are headed to.

I support Apple 100% in moving forward and removing the option of running, or producing, unreliable homebrewed code without authorization.

Actual programming experts can get a Mac Pro with and their programming license from Apple, or just run Linux on a PC."

Yes, I certainly trust that we won't be seeing posts like the above in the eventuality that Apple puts further restrictions on their (customer's) computers.

If I'm wrong I'll eat my hat. AND I'll switch to Linux.