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Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by grishka on Monday June 24, 2024 @08:21AM (#40775157)
MacOS is a great example of what happens when that competitive ground does exist. Most Mac apps are distributed outside of the app store, some aren't even notarized.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by mgrandl on Monday June 24, 2024 @11:20AM (#40777101)
Yes because developers don’t want to pay $100 to then go through a super annoying notarization process to distribute their FOSS app.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by burnerthrow008 on Monday June 24, 2024 @11:34AM (#40777304)
Yes, it is! Look at how much smaller MacOS market share is compared to iOS in their respective markets. Stated preference vs. revealed preference.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by grishka on Monday June 24, 2024 @11:43AM (#40777421)
US and Japan are the two unusual countries where iOS has more market share than Android. In the rest of the world, iOS is maybe 20%. For computers the situation is exacerbated by the fact that many people own one mostly for gaming, which means it's going to be Windows. Whereas an iPhone is considered a status symbol.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by rmbyrro on Monday June 24, 2024 @12:21PM (#40777932)
> In the rest of the world, iOS is maybe 20%

If you count the number of devices. By app store sales, the figure is maybe 50%, probably higher.

Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by detourdog on Monday June 24, 2024 @12:55PM (#40778325)
MacOS also isn’t connected to a cellular network.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by grishka on Monday June 24, 2024 @01:34PM (#40778710)
And what difference does that make with regard to software distribution models? It can easily be connected to a cellular network using one of those USB modem sticks btw.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by detourdog on Monday June 24, 2024 @08:50PM (#40783008)
Being connected to a cellular network puts different responsibilities on the platform vendor due to the global reach of a software problem.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by grishka on Monday June 24, 2024 @09:09PM (#40783149)
What "software problem" are you talking about?
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by detourdog on Tuesday June 25, 2024 @05:34AM (#40786329)
I’m talking about the carrier network requiring protections. The carrier like to verify devices on their network. There was a time when booking up a fax was illegal. Apple is responsible for the activity of the devices they create on the carrier network.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by grishka on Tuesday June 25, 2024 @06:16AM (#40786614)
> Apple is responsible for the activity of the devices they create on the carrier network.

Where did you get this idea? You are responsible for what your device does on the network. It's in your contract with your carrier. If you interfere with others' ability to use their phones on the same network, that has a good chance of the communications authority getting involved.

But we're talking about apps. The worst thing an app can do is DDoS something. That would just make you run out of data very quickly. Or auto-dial numbers (Android allows that, with a permission for which the app has to ask you), you'll just rack up an enormous bill and will learn to never make this mistake again. Or spam SMS, same thing.

Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by detourdog on Tuesday June 25, 2024 @08:30AM (#40787732)
Eveyone can interpret the various rules and regulations. I think you should do more research and reflection on how easy it is to be in cellular network.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by grishka on Tuesday June 25, 2024 @08:59AM (#40788032)
The "being in cellular network" is done by the modem. It's a separate CPU core that doesn't run any user code. If you jailbreak the user OS, you can send AT commands to it, which is still harmless as far as RF interference is concerned.

But I really struggle to understand how any of this relates to the distribution of apps that run in sandboxes.

Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by hot_gril on Monday June 24, 2024 @09:20PM (#40783235)
Are you implying that macOS has a smaller market share because of the lack of restrictions? Cause its competition, Windows, is less restricted if anything.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by YetAnotherNick on Monday June 24, 2024 @12:25PM (#40777970)
Android is the more closer to iOS example though. They have alt store and you can also download app through chrome, yet most users only use Google's play store.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by wongarsu on Monday June 24, 2024 @01:50PM (#40778845)
* Most users only use Google's play store, except for apps not available there

Certain categories of apps aren't deemed acceptable by Google (e.g. apps with adult content, apps that circumvent copyright, some "hacking" apps, etc). If you want any of those they are easy enough to find and sideload.

There is also a big community pirating legitimate Android apps. According to some for every one purchase ten people use a pirated version.

Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by hot_gril on Monday June 24, 2024 @09:09PM (#40783157)
Also, Fortnite isn't available on Google's store. Which is what that Epic case was about.
Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by grishka on Monday June 24, 2024 @09:40PM (#40783382)
Also, there are many apps from sanctioned Russian companies that can't be published on Google Play, so they only exist in alternative app stores like RuStore and/or as self-updating apks.

On iOS, they just can't "legally" have an app any more, period. Some made their apps PWAs, some say "just use the website", and some (Tinkoff/T-Bank in particular) keep trying to get into the app store with those double-bottom apps and also distribute them signed with enterprise certificates.

Re:Apple found in breach of EU competition rules by kube-system on Monday June 24, 2024 @01:39PM (#40778742)
The desktop is kind of a different space, though.

Most of the paid apps I've ever used on MacOS are well-known and cross-platform -- the kind of thing where you'd go to the developers website directly by name. So, of course the developer is going to guide those people down a path where they get all the revenue.

And the users of FOSS apps are overwhelmingly the people who will download a DMG from GitHub releases, and change their security settings to install it -- so why bother?

But for everyone else -- the $4.99 apps that aren't household names -- the App Store is probably where these are most often purchased. Although I doubt this market is very large on the desktop -- most people just use a browser and maybe some well known software that would have come in a box 20 years ago.