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Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by setopt on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @07:53AM (#40727380)
Anecdotal evidence:

Ever experienced that a bus is braking (near-constant deacceleration), and people seem fine; but then the bus comes to a halt and thus stops deaccelerating, and people suddenly fall on the floor?

I think at least the derivative or acceleration is important for how well people can compensate. Not sure about higher derivatives though.

Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by amelius on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @08:26AM (#40727607)
Acceleration equals force, so yeah, if you abruptly change acceleration then this equals abruptly changing the force on people in the bus. Acceleration should thus be continuous (not necessarily differentiable). I don't know how you would justify constraints on higher derivatives. Perhaps they mess with our own internal control mechanism?
Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by ccccccc1 on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @08:48AM (#40727774)
is it physically possible to have non-continuous acceleration?
Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by setopt on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @10:31AM (#40728677)
If we zoom in on a single electron absorbing the momentum of a single photon, it will accelerate “instantly”. The same goes for e.g. an unstable atomic nucleus that ”splits”.

At macroscopic scales, I’m not aware of exactly instantaneous acceleration, since you would need some time to “sync” the movement of each atom in the object. But some processes will of course look instantaneous at any given time scale.

Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by circuit10 on Friday June 21, 2024 @11:10AM (#40750441)
Aren’t you describing infinite acceleration, or discontinuous velocity?
Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by amelius on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @11:29AM (#40729197)
Voltages can change abruptly. Therefore, forces can change abruptly, and hence acceleration as well.
Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by shagie on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @09:14AM (#40727994)
Imagine a multistage rocket and the changes in acceleration.

Figure 4-3 in https://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/Documents/lvfea-AS506-Apollo1... shows this for Apollo 11.

Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by zardo on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @10:01AM (#40728398)
I imagine if you zoom in far enough on those points you have the acceleration continuously changing as pressure slowly builds in the engines over several microseconds.
Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by shagie on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @10:11AM (#40728487)
I was thinking more of the instant you shut off engines and disconnect 130,000 kg of mass of stage one.

There is an interesting Δa/Δt while fuel is consumed and mass changes.

There are discontinuities to the graph when engines are shut down and stages decoupled.

Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by sokoloff on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @12:16PM (#40729669)
That’s a legitimate question: over small enough time periods (as the bolts explode over a non-zero period of time), is it continuous or discontinuous?

Over a macro scale, it’s discontinuous, of course.

Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by tomek_ycomb on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @02:54PM (#40731312)
It's nature, it's continuous at small enough scales.

But, checkout Zeno's paradox for more on your philosophical questions

Re:Beyond velocity and acceleration: jerk, snap and higher d... by tomek_ycomb on Wednesday June 19, 2024 @02:52PM (#40731289)
I think bus is braking with a constant breaking force.

But, the bus has a non-constant kinetic energy (going up with the velocity*velocity, down as velocity goes down.)

So, you're actually producing a non-linear acceleration. This is jerk, but you can also think of it as just a non-linear acceleration and people are reacting to the fact it's not at all near constant deacceleration, and this is most noticable as velocity hits zero.

So, yes, it's jerk, but no, I think it can be intuitively better understood with pure acceleration terms and no jerk needed