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Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by jiggawatts on Sunday May 05, 2024 @07:50PM (#40269710)
> seemed very "1984" to me

In Australia, there was a recent introduction of "Acknowledgement of Country" at both the federal and state government level. Universities and other large institutions are also "doing their part". For example, in video call meetings with more than 'n' people, a manager will read out a statement for a minute at the start of the call acknowledging the "traditional custodians of the land upon which a meeting or event is to take place". In other words, the Aboriginals that white men largely wiped out over 200 years ago. See, e.g.: https://www.indigenous.unsw.edu.au/strategy/culture-and-coun...

So now, the descendants of those white men feel guilty and have to make a little speech before each meeting. It's the most dystopian bullshit I've ever had to personally participate in, ever.

This leads to some truly bizarre moments, like a recent meeting where half of the people were Indian subcontractors physically overseas, everyone else was a first-generation immigrant to Australia, and we had to acknowledge the traditional custodianship of the area by a tribe that was completely wiped out and no longer exists, not even descendants that might appreciate the gesture.

Similarly, in another meeting an "aboriginal elder" was chosen to speak because of their native heritage. That would be nice, except that this person was pasty white, blonde haired, blue eyed, and had freckles. Literally a white person making other white people feel guilty for something their common ancestors did!

The whole thing is an absurd farce played for political points, with no substance of any kind behind it. Actual aboriginals are no better off if in some city office a bunch of people in suits verbally self-flaggilate for sins committed hundreds of years ago by people that they might not even be descendants of. (Half the population is either a first or second generation immigrant!)

I wish there was some term that is the equivalent of "realpolitik", but for race relations, so that I can more succinctly express my disdain for this type of divorced-from-reality behaviour.

Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by snapetom on Sunday May 05, 2024 @10:28PM (#40270596)
Land acknowledgement statements are creeping into the US these days. I could be wrong, but they've been in Canada for a while.

There's been a bit more push back here. There's a lawsuit where a University of Washington compsci professor is suing the school for retaliation because he mocked the policy. He pointed out there is no evidence that the Salish people made use of University of Washington lands, so the whole thing is a farce.

Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by thaumasiotes on Sunday May 05, 2024 @11:23PM (#40270859)
> Land acknowledgement statements are creeping into the US these days.

What are the odds they make it to Israel?

Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by eli_gottlieb on Sunday May 05, 2024 @11:34PM (#40270903)
You want us to acknowledge whether we're on the traditional tribal lands of Dan, Binyamin, Menasseh, Yehudah, etc?
Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by Natsu on Monday May 06, 2024 @12:21AM (#40271114)
They'd probably want to go back to the Canaanites.
Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by thaumasiotes on Monday May 06, 2024 @01:06AM (#40271296)
> Binyamin

This one is really interesting. I note that you don't list the counterpart at all, but here's a selection from Weavers, Scribes, and Kings:

> In Syria in the early second millennium BCE, Amorite-speaking people grew up knowing if they belonged to the Banu-Yamina ("sons of the right" or "sons of the south") or the Banu-Sim'al ("sons of the left" or "sons of the north").

Benjamin is the only name I know of to memorialize an ethnic conflict that was apparently won long, long ago, so long ago that most people with an active interest in the time period have no idea it existed.

As far as your question goes, just the form of your answer is pretty good at reinforcing the point of my question.

Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by dang on Monday May 06, 2024 @02:22AM (#40271716)
We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40270596.
Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by thaumasiotes on Monday May 06, 2024 @07:05AM (#40273261)
You think it's off topic? What would be an example of a reason land acknowledgments are a bad idea in Israel that wouldn't also make them a bad idea somewhere else?
Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by dang on Monday May 06, 2024 @12:39PM (#40276534)
We already had one flamewar going about Israel.

I know it's annoying when these things get declared offtopic because of course they're connected by a sequence of associations—and you're right, it doesn't take that long of a sequence—but if you think about it from the overall topic of the thread, hopefully it makes more sense.

Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by kanbara on Sunday May 05, 2024 @11:57PM (#40271028)
it’s great that you as a person of european descent can be annoyed that people in the office have to make statements about traditional ownership of the land. You know how aboriginal australians live, and yet you think that changing attitudes towards the past—and reason why certain groups are disadvantaged—doesn’t help?

it’s not a “sin” — it was genocide over land that did not belong to the Crown. it’s a good thing that immigrants also have to acknowledge australian culture and heritage, as well.

as far as the white-looking aboriginal is concerned, we’re just not gonna open that door.

Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by alpaca128 on Monday May 06, 2024 @03:52AM (#40272257)
If reading a mandatory statement is ever changing attitudes then it's not in the direction you want. Doing this serves no real purpose, and I bet if you asked any of the affected people they'd prefer more than forced empty words.
Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by Tollen on Monday May 06, 2024 @01:24AM (#40271383)
I frequent a lot of Australian architecture and design firm websites. 99% of them all have this disclaimer on their site before you can see any content.

Is this by force or is it en vogue to do this in certain industries?

Re:MIT abandons use of DEI statements by zzo38computer on Monday May 06, 2024 @02:54AM (#40271905)
They are valid points; they do bad things with "diversity". I have seen such acknowledgements in Canada too sometimes, although I don't know if it is as bad as you describe there, because I do not know the details.

Better would be to actually avoid damaging the indigenous people and avoid damaging the land. What was done in the past is done, but you could avoid doing it again.

Saying stuff (especially stuff that doesn't even have proper good points and doesn't even help anything) is not a substitute for actually doing actually good things.