Good point. It's also covered, ketamine via IV, for pain management in some Canadian provinces.

Ketamine, huh? And how'd that work out for Matthew Perry?

Propofol is a useful, well-tested anesthetic. Michael Jackson abused it and discovered the consequences, but that doesn't make it any less legitimate of a drug.

Actually Michael Jackson's every dose was prescribed, overseen and administered by a professional physician in good standing. Was it Michael Jackson's fault that the good doctor actually didn't care about his well-being?

Do you think the current clinical ketamine protocol is to hand the patient a little baggie and tell em good luck? Ketamine is prescribed, overseen, and administered by a professional physician in good standing. You don't just get a bottle and take a bump every morning lmao. It's a monthly or less, supervised administration, with the possible addition of active therapy to my understanding. You can't just go walk into a doctors office and say, "doc I'm real sad, i want ketamine". The whole thing is extremely careful. Why is it different for propofol and ketamine?

Yeah but "drugs bad."

Now, as in the past, the stigma surrounding mind-altering chemicals overshadows any scientific evidence or testing supporting their therapeutic use.

It is a shame that we as a society allowed puritan ethics and drug alarmism to do such a number on our cultural relationships surrounding mind altering chemicals.

It is 100% stupid quackery to believe that people with serious mental disorders will find their answer in the bottom of a pill bottle.

This is selling false hope, but hey, it's OK to sell false hope, because insurance happily pays for false hope. What insurance doesn't pay for is real solutions.

So why not sell this idiotic drug-based bullshit. For God's sake, I am a child of the 80s. When Mrs. Nancy Reagan said "Just Say No" she meant "Just Say No" to drugs!!!

That certainly explains why various different chemicals are actually incredibly effective at treating various serious mental disorders.

Clearly years of study and scientific evidence are "100% stupid quackery".

Believe you me, it is clear that this attitude and perspective comes from the Reagan era moralizing that did (and continues to do) a real number on our society.

I am so hopeful that some of the stigma is seeming to dissolve and the war on drugs is starting to be recognized for the farce that it is. This will enable real research to be done about mind altering chemicals and the profound effects they have. From dissociative experiences to psychedelic experiences there is an entire frontier of new research to be done now that we are beginning to free ourselves from the hand-wringing of the last century

Bro here is what psychotropics are: they function as restraints. Chemical restraints. This was the overt aim of the original creators of psychiatric drugs, so that they could remove actual shackles and leg irons and replace them with the drugs.

This is what enabled Reagan to close the asylums, because the victims, er um patients, would theoretically no longer require physical restraint in institutions, but could be chemically restrained wherever they lived. And it's true: the mentally ill are now turned out onto the street by the thousands, and restrained by use of drugs. They keep coming back for refills and new prescriptions. It's almost as good as a physical tether or leash.

Psychotropics do nothing to heal or cure mental illness. They place the user in an altered state of consciousness. They dull the intellect, they blunt the affect, they banish the wit. A person under the influence will seldom fight back or think for themselves. They become pliant and malleable to whatever suggestion is foisted upon them. It's quite effective in that regard.

I think something is wrong with me, I keep getting into these kinds of conversations on HN instead of the insightful and intelligent conversations I used to have on here. I think I need to reassess the way I am engaging with this site.

I am not even going to bother linking the research about the actual observable effects of various medications on various mental illnesses because clearly youre an elder and if you were interested in the truth on this matter you would have sought it out by now.

For the second time in as many days I am disengaging from this exchange

> I think something is wrong with me

I am so sorry to hear that. Have you discussed these thoughts with your psychiatrist? I am sure that she has an arsenal of prescriptions to treat you with.

On second thought, during your weekly runs to the pharmacy for a stack of frozen pizzas and a fistful of prescriptions, your 16-hour workdays and 12 hours on social media consuming rage, fear, and paranoia, did you ever stop to think that there's a better way?

Have you considered eating an organic apple once in a while? 30 minutes of meditation, clearing your mind and listening to your Higher Power? What about disconnecting from the Internet and your phone for a few hours a week, at least? Getting outside, taking a walk, making some Vitamin D?

Sometimes the best cures are perhaps not as easy as popping a few pills; they're not subsidized by your insurance company, and they require forming better habits, but they are truly efficacious and have long-lasting, proven effects. Those are effects that are proven by science, by knowledge, by experience.

Any reputable citations on your claim? And no, “Infowars” is not reputable.

I get ads for ketamine on instagram btw. They send you a care package and do the whole thing over video chat. Sounds abominable to me but hey that's healthcare for you.

Edit: here it is, https://www.mindbloom.com/program

I'm confused because it seems like you're actually agreeing with the person you're replying to. Namely that improper administration of a drug by a "doctor [who doesn't] care for ... well-being" is an issue. Logically, that doesn't say anything about the appropriateness of the drug for others. Eg. You wouldn't say people shouldn't ever use opiates in hospital settings because opiates are abused elsewhere.

"X drug was bad for one single person, therefore it is bad for everyone in all situations and should be outlawed."

Indeed, big pharma loves how well this fear mongering tactic works - and they'd love a renaissance of "the war on drugs" to ban all cheap-relatively natural, highly effective medicines, so their patented drugs can make mega profits for them.

The whole Matthew Perry situation has a lot of odd behaviour to it, and I'd make a bet and put odds on ketamine being a cover story to detract from the likely culprit.

So maybe don't use it unsupervised in a hot tub?