News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by prmoustache on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @02:23AM (#38009778)
The thing is that 50% (even more) of the population should not be allowed to drive to begin with and we shouldn't wait for any technology to be ready to remove them from the road. That is the real elephant in the room that nobody wants to mention, especially political representatives who would be afraid to lose votes.
Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by Dylan16807 on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @02:40AM (#38009881)
You need to set up alternatives or you're destroying lives and they'll drive anyway.
Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by prmoustache on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @03:28AM (#38010187)
This is knee jerk reaction. Why the states and cities would have their role to increase public transit, other alternatives would set them up naturally in fact from private sector or people adopting other means of transportation.

[1] which would become immediately more profitable or less unprofitable depending on the area.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by robertlagrant on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @04:52AM (#38010707)
Getting those people into self-driving cars would be fantastic. Pretending there's a larger issue at play that overshadows that fantasticness is just pessimism. Sometimes it's easier to spend billions and grapple ingeniously with reality to create something new than it is to change the mind of a public official.
Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by Dylan16807 on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @05:34AM (#38010970)
In the areas where it's not profitable enough, it won't get set up. And we can guarantee that states and cities will leave huge gaps.
Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by prmoustache on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @05:40AM (#38011009)
And people would share drive or whatever it takes to make up for that.
Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by Dylan16807 on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @05:47AM (#38011051)
Lots of people have no one else going near their workplace at nearly the same time. Shared drives can't get anywhere near half of people to work.

So you have to fall back on paid trips, and that is too much money for a random shift making anything in the realm of minimum wage. It just doesn't work economically.

Many many areas without sufficient transit will suffer badly.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by prmoustache on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @06:07AM (#38011172)
If people are not willing to drive correctly without being distracted or under influence, that is their fault. We shouldn't have to trade security of everybody for the conveniency of the reckless ones. That whole sense of entitlement is baffling.

Besides cars are more expensive than riding a bike to a place where public transit is available.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by Dylan16807 on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @06:38AM (#38011344)
People need cars. You can't take away half of people's cars without massively restructuring transit.

In aggregate, people are correct to feel entitled to get around town without going bankrupt trying. Why would that baffle you?

You're not talking about exceptionally bad drivers, you're talking about half of them. That makes a big difference.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by prmoustache on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @07:51AM (#38011783)
If half of them are bad and dangerous, I am talking about bad drivers, regardless of the number.

People don't need cars. This is a luxury they based their life one. They can adapt the other way too.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by Dylan16807 on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @12:28PM (#38014540)
> I am talking about bad drivers, regardless of the number.

Th number matters for whether it's feasible to implement.

In a large sense everyone is a bad driver.

> People don't need cars. This is a luxury they based their life one. They can adapt the other way too.

People are stuck in situations that need cars. Adaptation without external help would take decades. Tens of millions would suffer badly.

With enough change cars could be turned back into a luxury, but right now they aren't a luxury for most people in the US.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by prmoustache on Thursday October 26, 2023 @02:32AM (#38022393)
People are much more adaptable than you pretend.
Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by Dylan16807 on Thursday October 26, 2023 @01:53PM (#38029229)
People can't make cost-effective options appear by sheer willpower.

They can bike short distances, but longer trips would depend on access to vehicles they don't own, whether transit or other people's cars.

If you give them enough warning they can adapt. But for a change like this the only solution for many people is "don't live there, good luck moving".

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by thereisnospork on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @02:44AM (#38009917)
Let's not look a gift horse in the mouth though?

Petty little things like political ramifications have a funny way of not being so petty,by definition 51% of people in a democracy can decide they will not be stopped from driving.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by prmoustache on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @03:38AM (#38010257)
> Petty little things like political ramifications have a funny way of not being so petty,by definition 51% of people in a democracy can decide they will not be stopped from driving.

I am pretty sure among those 51% of people only a fraction is made up of total assholes that wouldn't change the way they drive if rules were more strict while another fraction could accept more and more stringent laws, especially if they come gradually and would increase their standards of driving to keep that privilege.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by komali2 on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @03:13AM (#38010095)
> by definition 51% of people in a democracy can decide they will not be stopped from driving.

This is an oversimplification. First of all, some percentage of legal drivers are not allowed to vote (non-citizens, 15-18 year olds, felons). Second, this assumes a "pure democracy," which the USA is not for several reasons, first of which is the fact that it's representative, second of which is that its representative rations haven't been updated in like a hundred years (if they were, there'd be thousands of members of congress, and California would have over a tenth of them), and finally, because of disenfranchisement through voter roll purges, gerrymandering, and political arrests (such as when ex-con felons in Florida were directly lied to and told they were allowed to vote so as to entrap them into committing the felony of voting as a felon).

Anyway we shouldn't assume people wouldn't vote against taking away the right to drive, if it came with the building out of good public transit infrastructure in return, which is what the USA desperately needs anyway. Not that I'm naive enough to think there's political will to make this happen, but the whole self driving car thing would be pretty moot if it was easy to get around San Francisco as it is to get around Paris, NYC, Tokyo, Taipei, etc.

Re:Waymo says insurance data shows its driverless cars are s... by throwaway2037 on Wednesday October 25, 2023 @06:22AM (#38011253)

    remove them from the road
What if that was you? Or is everyone on HN a "good driver"? I am terrible driver. I am so easily distracted by construction sites or nice nature.