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Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by alphanullmeric on Saturday September 30, 2023 @12:30PM (#37717050)
Whether or mot my software is of quality is none of your business. I’m allowed to say “no guarantees”. It’s not your right to force me to provide you a guarantee. Force is only justified in response to force, and nobody forces you to use open source software.
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by lijok on Saturday September 30, 2023 @12:34PM (#37717090)
You misunderstood my comment. I am not suggesting that you be forced to provide guarantees.
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by alphanullmeric on Saturday September 30, 2023 @12:41PM (#37717173)
By defending this legislation you are.
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by lijok on Saturday September 30, 2023 @12:46PM (#37717209)
No. I am suggesting that you should not be producing goods for public consumption unless you are able to provide guarantees.

Noone's going to force you to provide guarantees for goods you did not produce.

Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by alphanullmeric on Saturday September 30, 2023 @12:51PM (#37717260)
Are you suggesting it or saying it should be illegal? Again, by defending these laws you want it to be forced.

I never said anything about software I didn’t produce, should I interpret this as you agreeing that you will force me to provide guarantees for open source software I do make?

Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by lijok on Saturday September 30, 2023 @01:17PM (#37717550)
> should I interpret this as you agreeing that you will force me to provide guarantees for open source software I do make?

Yes. However, the way you use the term "force me", at least to me, implies an unjust enforcement of a law, post-publishing that was not made clear pre-publishing.

Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by alphanullmeric on Saturday September 30, 2023 @01:27PM (#37717652)
It’s unjust if you believe force is only justified in response to force, which you do not. Glad we cleared that up.
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by lijok on Saturday September 30, 2023 @01:49PM (#37717909)
You seem very intent on labelling legal obligations as being forced to do something. That, at least to me, is a clear mischaracterization of the issue at hand.
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by Ekaros on Saturday September 30, 2023 @12:51PM (#37717265)
I'm starting to believe that "no guarantees" should be explicitly banned. You release software, you should guarantee it.
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by rpdillon on Saturday September 30, 2023 @01:10PM (#37717467)
For what use case?
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by Ekaros on Saturday September 30, 2023 @02:30PM (#37718345)
Every reasonably viable use case.
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by rpdillon on Sunday October 01, 2023 @10:19AM (#37726179)
This is entirely divorced from reality, then. You'd have to make the code resilient to failure modes specific to operating environments you're entirely unaware of while authoring the code. E.g. someone takes your code and cross-compiles it for use as part of one of several daemons running in an embedded system on an architecture you never tested on, and it leaks memory in that environment due to how to OS allocates memory there. I'm not thrilled with this example I just made up, but I hope it captures the distinction between writing an algorithm and deploying a full solution into a known environment.

The idea that software engineers can 'guarantee' against this is fantasy and precisely what integration testing is for. It has to be the case that those who deploy the code take responsibility for its behavior, not the original authors, since only those deploying have the full picture of the system.

Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by ls612 on Saturday September 30, 2023 @02:22PM (#37718270)
Would you like to propose a method for guaranteeing your software is bug free?
Re:European Legislation Could Create Liability for Free-Soft... by tzs on Saturday September 30, 2023 @03:41PM (#37718997)
The proposed law does not require software to be bug free.