I totally get that. People will always complain about some new design fad, whether it's actually good or not.
However... we're talking about heavy vehicles traveling at high speed with humans inside. You simply don't have to takes your eyes off the road as long with tactile controls as you do with touch screens.
- Blinkers
- High beams
- Gearbox
- Climate control temperature up/down
- Cruise control enable/disable, speed change
- Media volume, media next/previous
- Phone call answer/hangup/volume
- Windshield wipers
On the next Model 3 version, they are moving the gearbox controls over to the screen. I have my doubts about that, but I'll complain once I have driven one.
I do see a lot of praise for its ability to auto shift, basically it should predict the direction of the vehicle based on the surrounding environment.
The other situations involving wipers are also annoying when the auto windshield wiper sensor becomes invisibly dirty. The wipers will activate nonstop during Autopilot or just on auto while driving in daylight sun, particularly at sunrise and sunset. It is an extreme frustration to have to look at the screen to click the slider to turn them off.
As of the current software version, the way the buttons on the stalk or the wheel work is they either activate something one off e.g. high beams for a moment, or wipe once, and/or they pop up a little menu on the bottom left corner of the screen where the media controls are, and you have to use the touchscreen to activate them. Recently a mechanism to press and hold the steering wheel scrollwheel to activate a menu was added, but it's just impossible to use without looking. I am not sure if I am special and/or are using it wrong or something, but the menu pops up in a location that is obscured normally by my arm/the wheel when holding the steering wheel at a normal and designed position with both hands. Annoyingly, this is also where the "Apply slight turning force to steering wheel" nag prompt appears, which is a terrible and unnoticeable place to put a safety related alert that is actually designed to have you keep your eyes on the road. This really should have the option to be an audible and friendly chime.
The lack of a turn signal sound when the computer crashes, is, by the way, another omission in my opinion, because the turn signal stalk is only a momentary button. The turn signals work but you'll have no clue while driving if they're actually on, without the screen and the sound.
I mean, maybe these are all normal and maybe I'm just really picky about things. I really do like the overall experience of using the large screen, as the GPS is much more glanceable with this setup and passengers can route plan or discuss the route. The apps are all terrible though, like Spotify/Apple Music, and they're unnecessarily slow and buggy with small touch targets as if they want to trick you into keeping your eyes off the road for more than a fraction of a second.
The UI design is kind of mixed, tbh. I'm sure some of these issues can be resolved by software, but at least there are the "S3XY Buttons", a third party accessories with a set of BLE buttons that you can stick anywhere you like that activate things using CAN bus injection.
Of course, that might (not sure, dont have this accessory) create synchronization bugs like (annoyingly, sometimes the car saying it is in reverse when it is in drive), but these happen anyway by itself.
No need. Push the button on the left stalk, press the left scroll wheel to the left for a couple of seconds.
> Recently a mechanism to press and hold the steering wheel scrollwheel to activate a menu was added, but it's just impossible to use without looking
I have mine configured for climate control temperature. I don't look at the screen. Long press, two clicks up or two clicks down.
> The lack of a turn signal sound when the computer crashes
If you mean that the turn signal has no sound, you are mistaken. The turn signal has a sound. I have no idea, though, if it sounds when the computer crashes; mine never did.
Wait until you see how easy it is in older cars…
But, think about this comment in context.
As a reminder: I was replying to someone who was arguing that the anti-touch-screen crowd is not justified in their hatred of touch screens in cars. My position is to agree with that crowd that touch screens in cars are bad UX.
With that in mind, your comment actually vindicates my position. Touch screens are dangerously stupid UX in a car. So much so that Tesla--which has an image of being futuristic, sleek, and minimal (aesthetically)--not only has the necessary-for-driving controls on the steering wheel, but also non-essentials like media controls. If touch screens weren't objectively worse than physical controls, is it too far of a stretch to think that Mr. Musk would've wanted them in the touch screen for even more sleekness and minimalism?
In any case, I think we're all agreeing in this thread that touch controls for these things would be unsafe and worse than physical controls.
The case now needs to be argued that touch screens are at least equally good as physical controls for those other operations in cars. But, I don't see how that line of argumentation can possibly go well after we've established that the important controls don't belong as touch buttons.
The UI question is only valid for controls used frequently. For everything else, I think it is already settled that they are better in the screen. At the very least, for the sake of UI simplicity. I can't imagine a physical interface for enabling or disabling every driving assistance option in a Tesla. It'd become an airliner button panel.
But, to be fair, I don't think that most people who vocally hate touch screens in cars are upset that the car manufacturers are making them set their clock via touch buttons. I assume (and I could be wrong) that they're talking about things like A/C settings, radio tuning, etc. If they aren't, then at least I am. Being able to reach over with my muscle memory to change the radio to one of my presets (yeah, I'm some old-school weirdo who still listens to FM radio when I drive) is something I appreciate.
I don't stare at my Unihertz Titan as I'm typing this. I'm looking around me.
Physical button are superior. At least to me obviously.
This is so not the same thing.
Bad touchscreen UIs suck, but that’s also true of phones. Good tactile controls have some advantages, but ultimately they’re minor and worse on net than a good touchscreen interface.
People on HN will disagree (like people here disagree about everything), but the market will settle it.
The car touchscreen doesn't work since you need to operate buttons without directly looking at them, purely by tactile feel.
This is not a problem touchscreens we're able to fix so far, and I don't think this will change any time soon since there's just not enough ways for a touchscreen to provide this level of tactile feedback.
It really is not IMO.
A touchscreen UI is a visual medium. That is not what you want/need while operating a vehicle. You should be able to change the AC by feeling for the button and not taking your eyes off the road.
This isn't just HN being HN again. Driving enthusiasts are pushing back on touchscreens.
I bet not.
Maybe I've just been driving so long that the variety of cars has impeded my ability to develop muscle memory. But I doubt it.
That just does not happen with physical controls.
In the case of the Tesla, BTW, the infotainment is 100% separate from the computer that controls the car. E.g. you loose the turn signal sounds, but the signals themselves work, etc. AP will continue to function, but you can't turn it on without the infotainment screen running. You can reboot the infotainment as you're driving down the street without it affecting your control of the car.
I pulled over and called the dealer service department for advice, and we decided it was safe (for the car) to continue my journey. But with the partial instrumentation failure, the air-conditioning also refused to operate, so I had a sweaty summertime trip.
I was driving a car once where the handle to the stick shift literally popped off in my hand. So... no, that's just silly. Stuff breaks. Important stuff breaks. You deal with that with careful design and redundancy[1], not whining on the internet about touchscreens.
[1] Like how in the Tesla all the driving controls are, in fact, NOT connected to the touchscreen controlled by the MCU but to the AP computer.
The reality is also that, in my Honda, a bunch of the buttons that aren't on the steering wheel/column are things I touch once in a blue moon and there are probably buttons I haven't touched since I initially set up the car.
And I don't actually want to navigate using my phone which is precariously hanging off an air vent using some some accessory clamp. Or by all means go old school and navigate using a map open in your lap.
(That said, I do think a lot of car manufacturers should be more thoughtful about preserving certain tactile controls however.)
Cars don't really have this problem because they only have one primary job, and all other functions (eg climate control) are easily predicted by the manufacturer.
It reminds me of the complaining in the early iPhone days about lack of a physical keyboard.