> have kids, develop increasingly esoteric personal hobbies, get into fitness/longevity

This is the route I've taken and my mental health is much better for it. I still wonder what I'm missing out on had I stayed on the treadmill, even now, but I keep telling myself the life balance far outweighs the work balance.

Nothing worthwhile. I just turned down a L+1 jump to management because I certainly don’t want to stress/deal with any of that business BS when I could do my fairly easy IC job and take the kids to the park or go to the gym at lunch since my calendar is mostly empty

I’d probably make the same choice, but I haven’t had the offer yet.

I’m curious what do you expect to happen to your salary over the years if you stay at the same level? Or are you able to be promoted and remain an IC?

Over time I got more relaxed about promotion and compensation. As software engineers our salaries are already in the top 5-10% of most countries, of course as humans we are always unsatisfied and wanting more but... Is it worth it? To keep on the treadmill, battling out in the ever-increasing political games one needs to play when growing inside a big org career to achieve another 10% increase in salary?

I'm also privileged to live in a society where even with half of my salary it'd be entirely possible to live a comfortable and fulfilling life, where my kids won't need my money to be secure in their education and healthcare. The career game was more interesting when I was in my 20s, now it's just a bunch of bullshit that I can choose to care about or not, and not caring about it is absurdly liberating.

To each their own, of course, personally I came to realise that I don't value the career stuff so much, I'm already pretty comfortable (and many times more than any of my ancestors or close family were). There's so much more to life than playing corporate-bullshit, stressing over how to please a business to etch another salary bump. Corporations that deep down don't care about individuals, values, etc., it's just about shareholder value, I prefer to focus my attention on individuals and things that bring joy, love, and interesting experiences in life.

Is it that you relaxed over time or you just made enough money in your 20s? Accounting for the global economy and the implied age it would be surprising if you were not—relative to a mid-20s now—so far ahead that compensation should not matter.

a good paying non-management job with a overseeable workload is what i'm look for as well.

kinda hard to find as most hr ppl seem to be looking for either rock stars or code monkeys, any tipps?

Find a midsize company that isn’t a tech company and needs help maintaining a very old but critical system. There’s very little accountability since management doesn’t understand software and it pays well because it’s boring as shit and no one wants to do it

From what I've seen, amassing riches is either a weird game to people, the means to a lifestyle they truly crave (status, luxury, ...), or an unhealthy obsession with security (both for themselves and their offspring).

I was, maybe still am, in the last bucket. But I'm starting to realise that security is a quite mythical thing - you can always think of more risks and counter measures, at least at the point I got to. Now I'm thinking the thing I truly need, and want to pass on to my children, is the ability to adapt to changing circumstances and stay resilient.

I've had a very similar realisation recently. A lot of what I spent the last 5 years doing has largely been to reach a state of security where I feel I 'no longer need to worry'.

Due to a death in the family, an unfounded health scare and a rather paranoid money scare it's been made quite clear that this utopia of 'secure' does not exist no matter what I do.

It has lead to a reduction in stress in some ways since the pressure to maintain everything and keep it safe is less if 100% confidence can never be reached so chasing it is pointless.

I don't know if you've had a similar experience but I'm currently at the stage of re-evaluating what I value since if some things (like wealth and health) are unavoidably temporary then the sacrifices I'm willing to make to maintain them are less than if they were assured or permanant.

I'd be curious to know how this has effected your outlook on life as I'm just starting with this now and it has certainly left me a bit lost. Although I don't think that's a bad thing.

Sorry for the slight ramble, just been very much on my mind at them moment.

Sorry to hear that!

I have a positive outlook. I deal with the problems I encounter and enjoy the little things. This year was pretty good, I pulled off some stuff I didn't know I could do. Now I feel more confident that I can deal with lots of things life'll throw at me (not everything of course).

Happy to chat some more outside a public comment thread :D There's an email address in my profile.

Security is not mythical, at least in the near to short term, enough time for your kids to grow up.

Passive income from $10M would secure access for 99% of food, water, heat, shelter, education, transportation, healthcare, retirement, and legal costs.

$5M will get you most of the way there too.

But what if you are sued due to something completely out of your control and lose your wealth?

Or face a medical problem that requires expensive treatment not covered by your insurance or government healthcare?

Or your investments fail, the USSR fell very quickly risking pensions people relied on, the roman empire fell. US investments could too; I mean they kinda did in the early 1900's, recovery from that took time.

I'm not saying any of these things are likely to happen (they really aren't and I'd be supprised if any did in the next 100 years). But they could so any amount of security money offers is limited and not certain.

I suppose it depends if you would equate security and certainty to the same thing? I certainly did but wouldn't now. I wager you don't since you said 99% not 100%.

> But what if you are sued due to something completely out of your control and lose your wealth?

You will be able to afford lawyers, and the US justice system is not so corrupt that you would lose millions of dollars for no reason. Don’t drive drunk, don’t operate a business, and buy umbrella insurance and you should be fine. Biggest risk would probably be divorce, or accusations of abuse from within the family.

> Or face a medical problem that requires expensive treatment not covered by your insurance or government healthcare?

This also sounds super rare as health insurers are legally required to cover all evidence based healthcare, and there is an appeals process for denied coverage. As long as you can afford the premiums and annual out of pocket maximum, which are legally at most $40k to $50k per year for a family, you should be okay.

Of course, you might have to pony up an additional $10k to $20k to buy concierge care/direct primary care to buy timely access to actual doctors rather than see a Nurse Practitioner or Physician’s Assistant, but your passive income from $10M should suffice.

> Or your investments fail, the USSR fell very quickly risking pensions people relied on, the roman empire fell. US investments could too; I mean they kinda did in the early 1900's, recovery from that took time.

If $10M in the US invested in broad market low cost index funds backstopped by the federal US government is not secure enough for you to relax, then it might be impossible to help you feel sufficiently secure because this world does not offer many better guarantees.

> I suppose it depends if you would equate security and certainty to the same thing? I certainly did but wouldn't now. I wager you don't since you said 99% not 100%.

I do not know what the purpose of distinguishing security and certainty would be in this context, they seem interchangeable. And since nothing in life is 100%, 99% is a way to convey “all the security that is realistically obtainable”.

I totally agree with pretty much every point you make.

I also invest in US majority index funds so certainly agree they are the best bet. I do however think security and certainty are different in that one is 99% and one is 100%.

I'd say it depends on your personality and risk tolerance but when talking about life destroying events I'd say 1% is quite significant. For example a 1% chance of a car crash per journey would be unacceptably high.

Thank you for taking the time to write such a detailed reply by the way, I'm thinking around this topic a lot at the moment so debating the details is very valuable to help reach a view I'm content with.

It's only mythical if you keep moving the goal posts the closer you get - that's what I'm talking about. I've been there (to a degree), I've seen others who've been there. And that's what I'd call an unhealthy obsession.

* and then make all your money riding a random crypto token but focus your story on “how you made so much” from your hustle

Crazy how having kids is lumped in with esoteric personal hobbies.

how so?

i mean, the most esoteric ppl i know aren't even married

Can I pick and choose?

I see a lot of people are going with `climb the ladder' + `have kids'. Others go for `side hustle' + `fitness`