News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:"Lighten up" by Swizec on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @06:23PM (#3737075)
Public perception (as judged by art, which usually represents a slightly caricatured version of reality) seems to imply that your attractiveness and the appropriateness of your comments are inversely correlated.

That is to say, if you tell a woman she looks good, it will be a compliment if she likes you, a sexist remark if she doesn't.

Re:"Lighten up" by jiggy2011 on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @07:30PM (#3737386)
There's some truth in this, I have observed women who will happily let some strange guy basically feel them up in a club if he is good looking and call him "cheeky".

Whereas an ugly looking guy who makes eye contact or smiles at them is regarded as a creep or potential rapist.

In fact I remember reading somewhere that a persons physical attractiveness had a fairly significant affect on the likely verdict where they to be the defendant in a trial.

Re:"Lighten up" by dlitz on Thursday March 22, 2012 @12:36AM (#3738413)
They're all creeps. Some just get away with it.
Re:"Lighten up" by ryanwaggoner on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @07:44PM (#3737431)
There's a running joke on Reddit that the best way to avoid being labeled creepy when hitting on a woman is to:

   1. Be attractive.
   2. Don't be unattractive.
And there is definitely truth to this.
Re:"Lighten up" by gojomo on Thursday March 22, 2012 @04:56AM (#3738965)
...which is lifted from an SNL skit, with Tom Brady:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBVuAGFcGKY

Re:"Lighten up" by scott_s on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @09:35PM (#3737884)
Then it's a good thing this isn't Reddit.
Re:"Lighten up" by freshhawk on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @10:20PM (#3738019)
Yeah, the conversation here has been so much more enlightened.
Re:"Lighten up" by mkramlich on Thursday March 22, 2012 @01:16AM (#3738509)
I've generally found that when it comes to matters of gender and sexuality, the more "enlightened" one claims to be, the far less actual experience in life, with real people, one actually has. The college/twenty-something years in particular are wonderful for many things, and universities are wonderful for many things, but one thing they're bad at is giving you a realistic view of the world as it actually is, and people as they actually are, rather than as how one ideally might like them to be. A view less based on reality than based on theory or political agenda.
Re:"Lighten up" by scott_s on Thursday March 22, 2012 @07:44AM (#3739293)
The next time I have to sit through an HR-and-Legal mandated harassment course for work, and I catch myself thinking "Is anyone actually this clueless to think saying such things is okay?" I'll make sure to remind myself, yes, some people are.
Re:"Lighten up" by freshhawk on Thursday March 22, 2012 @02:31PM (#3741236)
Yeah, the number of "this is how things should be" type comments here is silly. As if we can wish away the neurological aspects of human beings we don't like or that don't fit with whatever utopian ideology they espouse.

It's naive but I did expect at least a little pragmatism from this group.

Re:"Lighten up" by tomp on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @08:33PM (#3737659)
There's much more to this... A totally attractive guy (model-like) that emanates low self-confidence (shyness, bad posture, ...) could still have his comments perceived in a negative way (i.e. as being sexist, not compliments). So, I believe that we tend to judge this from the perspective of the perceived intent of the person making the comments. A self confident gut -> he's probably just being sincere -> cure. A not-self-confident guy -> he's trying to get something from her -> looser. (Probably applies with the sex roles reversed, but I have no actual experience to lean on).

At the workplace, the label looser is just switched for the label creepy/sexist.

Re:"Lighten up" by knightenvy on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @11:03PM (#3738151)
I have always believed that confidence has a huge effect on what a person looks like. The most beautiful person can look like a mess if they do not believe in themselves.
Re:"Lighten up" by jiggy2011 on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @09:04PM (#3737781)
Perhaps but attractive looking people rarely emenate low confidence if at all, confident but ugly guys are more common but still relatively rare.

I guess because of a positive or negative feedback cycle.

Re:"Lighten up" by MPSimmons on Thursday March 22, 2012 @08:40AM (#3739426)
...because there are no examples of overconfident sexist assholes?
Re:"Lighten up" by sherlocked on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @11:04PM (#3738155)
There's a world of difference between a compliment (such as "nice dress!" and "Katie's got the low cut dress on today! I know where I'm sitting!"

You could look like a literal Ryan Gosling clone and I'd still be offended if you told me the second statement at work.

Re:"Lighten up" by BenOfTomorrow on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @08:25PM (#3737613)
If it's in an wildly inappropriate context, her perception of you can switch from "like" to "dislike" quickly.

It's a factor, but lots of women have stories about attractive creeps.

Re:"Lighten up" by jschmitz28 on Wednesday March 21, 2012 @08:00PM (#3737488)
Do you mean directly correlated? If you are more attractive, your comments will be more appropriate. If you are less attractive, your comments will be less appropriate.
Re:"Lighten up" by mkramlich on Thursday March 22, 2012 @01:12AM (#3738496)
> That is to say, if you tell a woman she looks good, it will be a compliment if she likes you, a sexist remark if she doesn't.

this. nailed it. it depends way more on how she feels and what she thinks of you, than on whether the words/act itself is somehow inherently wrong or sexist. that doesn't mean it's wise to say things or do things like that in the workplace: it isn't. but based on decades of actual experience on this planet this, your observation, rings true to me.