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Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by mathisfun123 on Thursday August 24, 2023 @07:57AM (#37247781)
> Second, this is similar to the "equalise things by dragging everyone down to the same level"-type of thinking.

> and not allowing for an opportunity to write really good code. Basically, enforced mediocrity.

> straightforward, laziest, zero optimisation code, and giving themselves an excuse for that.

> justify their laziness,

Jesus christ you have so much disdain for such a large set of people. Have you ever considered that you might have a chip on your shoulder about Haskell adoption?

> There should be a place for languages which are ambitious and aren't afraid to break things.

There is - it's research and hobby, not production. Like literally "not afraid to break things" is the antithesis of an industrial language.

Sometimes I wonder if some language communities really are cults. It's the same with Lisp - replace "type system" with "homoiconic" and you have the exact same mantras about ultimate supremacy and "intellectual" superiority. But the proof of the pudding is in the eating and across probably 10 computing devices in my home, not a single one has any Haskell or Lisp programs running on it. Lots of Java, C, C++, Python, Rust, Bash, JavaScript, even Perl (probably) but not a single binary compiled from Haskell or Lisp interpreter to be found. To any reasonable person, that should be a strong signal about the so called "power" and value of their sacred cow.

Put another way: the word language in the concept of programming language isn't accidental and learning a niche programming language is comparable to learning a niche human language - have fun, expand your horizons, but don't pretend it's useful.

Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by jamincan on Thursday August 24, 2023 @08:28AM (#37247997)
> Sometimes I wonder if some language communities really are cults. It's the same with Lisp - replace "type system" with "homoiconic" and you have the exact same mantras about ultimate supremacy and "intellectual" superiority. But the proof of the pudding is in the eating and across probably 10 computing devices in my home, not a single one has any Haskell or Lisp programs running on it. Lots of Java, C, C++, Python, Rust, Bash, JavaScript, even Perl (probably) but not a single binary compiled from Haskell or Lisp interpreter to be found. To any reasonable person, that should be a strong signal about the so called "power" and value of their sacred cow.

Xmonad and pandoc are probably the most heavily used Haskell programs. Not necessarily contradicting your overall point, just exhibiting the two examples that someone might reasonably be expected to run into.

Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by mathisfun123 on Thursday August 24, 2023 @08:32AM (#37248030)
fair enough - i don't use xmonad but i do use pandoc on occasion. in full transparency: it occurred to me that i am familiar with postgrest, though i've never run it personally. still no lisp programs though!
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by littlestymaar on Thursday August 24, 2023 @12:30PM (#37250907)
Isn't HN written in lisp?
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by Pannoniae on Thursday August 24, 2023 @01:19PM (#37251754)
Arc, but I think it counts because it's a lisp-like....
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by mathisfun123 on Thursday August 24, 2023 @07:00PM (#37255655)
and <looks around> what can we conclude from this?
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by Pannoniae on Thursday August 24, 2023 @07:21PM (#37255822)
that lisp is a perfectly usable language for writing cool and usable things :)
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by mathisfun123 on Thursday August 24, 2023 @08:23PM (#37256286)
what exactly is hn usable for other than aggregating links and text comments?
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by Pannoniae on Friday August 25, 2023 @03:03AM (#37258942)
If it wasn't an usable and/or interesting thing, you wouldn't use it...
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by doktrin on Thursday August 24, 2023 @10:32AM (#37249171)
> xmonad

I got rid of xmonad in favor of i3 ages ago - precisely because it doesn't force me to edit a Haskell script just to change a keybinding.

Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by Pannoniae on Thursday August 24, 2023 @08:02AM (#37247826)
"Jesus christ you have so much disdain for such a large set of people." - Correct. I kind of hate myself too. If everyone is afraid to say these things or afraid to have a disdain for bad things, nothing will improve. Things improve because some people are pissed off enough to do something about it, not by just going along with whatever.

"Have you ever considered that you might have a chip on your shoulder about Haskell adoption?" - No. I barely use Haskell myself. This could have been written about any other language, my opinion would have been similar. I don't have a strong emotional attachment to Haskell specifically.

Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by vaibhavsagar on Thursday August 24, 2023 @09:21AM (#37248438)
I personally use Vim, but Emacs alone is IMO the strongest counterexample to your claim about Lisp interpreters (followed by all the programs scriptable with Guile).
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by mathisfun123 on Thursday August 24, 2023 @09:24AM (#37248469)
I mean I'm aware of emacs but I am also a vim user so I proudly stand by my claim.
Re:Leaving Haskell Behind by yakshaving_jgt on Thursday August 24, 2023 @04:41PM (#37254265)
Haskell isn't just used for small programs for computer nerds.

Haskell is successfully used in industry, in some cases with billions of users.

https://engineering.fb.com/2015/06/26/security/fighting-spam...