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Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by skissane on Friday August 11, 2023 @01:36PM (#37091439)
> I used to have a competitor who would email PayPal every couple of weeks to tell them our web site had CP on it just so PayPal would instantly shut off our payment gateway while they investigated

Isn’t this sort of behaviour criminal? (I mean the competitor submitting a fake child pornography report, not whatever PayPal did to respond to it.) And if not, surely it ought to be.

Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by kmeisthax on Friday August 11, 2023 @01:48PM (#37091593)
Illegal? Probably, but I'm not a lawyer. I imagine the words "unfair competition" might be present somewhere on the legal paperwork. And if it's illegal but not criminal, you have to sue the competitor yourself, which is expensive and time-consuming.

PayPal probably should have some kind of hold on your account saying "don't shut off the account until we've investigated" but that might itself be abusable (see Facebook Xcheck). If this behavior is illegal they might also have standing to sue whoever is sending the reports.

All of that requires you to have at least some amount of evidence tying the false reports to the competitor, too. Or at least enough evidence to survive a motion to dismiss so you can use discovery to get the rest of the story.

Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by skissane on Friday August 11, 2023 @02:12PM (#37091920)
> Illegal? Probably, but I'm not a lawyer. I imagine the words "unfair competition" might be present somewhere on the legal paperwork

I was thinking more along the lines of “child pornography is a crime, and making a knowingly false report of a crime is a crime”.

I know it is a crime (in many jurisdictions) to make a knowingly false report of a crime to law enforcement; but PayPal aren’t law enforcement. I don’t think that should matter though - if it isn’t already a crime to make a knowingly false report of a crime to a business, then it should be

Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by nonameiguess on Friday August 11, 2023 @02:18PM (#37091985)
What is considered criminal depends on the jurisdiction, but I doubt making false reports to a private company is criminal in very many. At least in the US, you could certainly get sued for continually disrupting someone else's business, but to sue another party, they'd need to also be in the US so they could be served and actually subject to being forced to appear in a US court and a judgment against them could be enforceable. Otherwise, you end up in a situation like some Chinese business owner just building their own McDonald's. Sure, it violates all kinds of US ip laws, but if their home jurisdiction doesn't care about US ip laws, there isn't shit you can do about it.
Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by skissane on Friday August 11, 2023 @02:29PM (#37092123)
> What is considered criminal depends on the jurisdiction, but I doubt making false reports to a private company is criminal in very many.

I live in the Australian state of New South Wales. I just looked up our state law on this topic. Section 314 of the Crimes Act 1900 says: “A person who makes an accusation intending a person to be the subject of an investigation of an offence, knowing that other person to be innocent of the offence, is liable to imprisonment for 7 years.” I haven’t looked at the case law or anything, but just going by the wording of the statute, it seems broad enough to potentially include false accusations made to private companies in its scope.

Of course, probably none of the parties in the case under discussion live in my jurisdiction, so its laws are irrelevant. Still, if other jurisdictions don’t have a law like this on the books, maybe they should

Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by qingcharles on Friday August 11, 2023 @11:29PM (#37096735)
That's fascinating, thank you. I've been involved with criminal law for a decade and not seen a law like that. I wonder if the accusation has to be made to a law enforcement agency, or whether it would apply in my situation where the person made an accusation to a private entity?
Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by skissane on Saturday August 12, 2023 @05:51AM (#37098599)
> I wonder if the accusation has to be made to a law enforcement agency, or whether it would apply in my situation where the person made an accusation to a private entity?

I can't find any case law which directly answers your question; as far as I am aware, no case has ever been prosecuted under that law for the type of scenario we are talking about (but just because it hasn't happened yet, isn't in itself a bar for it happening some day in the future). This law never says the false accusation has to be made to a law enforcement agency, even though similar laws in other jurisdictions do explicitly say that; I don't see why a court would insert that requirement when the text doesn't explicitly contain it. But of course, nobody can be certain unless some day the matter actually comes before a court to decide.

Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by qingcharles on Friday August 11, 2023 @03:01PM (#37092520)
Yes, but it was done anonymously. The competitor denied all knowledge of it, but the guy he paid to do the reporting would talk to me through chat every day to gloat about it.

I ended up paying 15000EUR bounty to track the guy down. Found him in Germany. 15 year old kid. Had somebody talk his mother about him. Never had a problem again after that.

Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by zlg_codes on Friday August 11, 2023 @03:26PM (#37092836)
Did you ever try to recover the amount spent on the bounty? That kid caused damages to your business.
Re:YouTube-Dl Site Goes Offline as Hosting Provider Enforces... by qingcharles on Friday August 11, 2023 @04:09PM (#37093371)
No, I took it as a cost of doing business. I only went that far after he managed to find my wife's cell phone number and started calling to harass her.