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Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by somedude895 on Thursday August 10, 2023 @01:29AM (#37072324)
I could imagine CNET‘s SEO team got an average rank goal instead of absolute SEO traffic. So by removing low ranked old pages the avg position of their search results goes closer to the top even though total traffic sinks. I‘ve seen stuff like this happen at my own company as well, where a team‘s KPIs are designed such that they‘ll ruin absolute numbers in order to achieve their relative KPI goals, like getting an increase in conversion rates by just cutting all low-conversion traffic.
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by RheingoldRiver on Thursday August 10, 2023 @01:37AM (#37072366)
This is why KPIs or targets should NEVER be calculated values like averages or ratios. The team is then incentivized to do something hostile such as not promote the content as much so that the ratio is higher, as soon as they barely scrape past the impressions mark.
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by cedilla on Thursday August 10, 2023 @03:48AM (#37073211)
When deciding KPIs, Goodhart's law should always be kept in mind: when a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.

It's really hard to not create perverse incentives with KPIs. Targets like "% of tickets closed within 72 hours" can wreck service quality if the team is under enough pressure or unscrupulous.

Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by iamacyborg on Thursday August 10, 2023 @05:56AM (#37074031)
I mean, ideally you just have both an absolute and a calculated value to ensure both trend in the right direction.
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by hef19898 on Thursday August 10, 2023 @06:55AM (#37074441)
Sure they can, e.g. on-time delivery (or even better shipments missing the promised delivery date) is a ratio. Or inventory turn rates, there you actually want people to attack the denominator.

Generaly speaking, an easy solution is to attach another target to either the nominator or denominator, a target that requires people to move that in value in acertqin direction. That might even be a different team thanthe one having goals on the ratio.

Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by acdha on Thursday August 10, 2023 @08:53AM (#37075534)
> Sure they can, e.g. on-time delivery (or even better shipments missing the promised delivery date) is a ratio. Or inventory turn rates, there you actually want people to attack the denominator.

These are good in that they’re directly aligned with business outcomes but you still need sensible judgement in the loop. For example, say there’s an ice storm or heat wave which affects delivery times for a large region – you need someone smart enough to recognize that and not robotically punish people for failing to hit a now-unrealistic goal, or you’re going to see things like people marking orders as canceled or faking deliveries to avoid penalties or losing bonuses.

One example I saw at a large old school vendor was having performance measured directly by units delivered, which might seem reasonable since it’s totally aligned with the company’s interests, except that they were hit by a delay on new CPUs and so most of their customers were waiting for the latest product. Some sales people were penalized and left, and the cagier ones played games having their best clients order the old stuff, never unpack it, and return it on the first day of the next quarter - they got the max internal discount for their troubles so that circus cost way more money than doing nothing would have, but that number was law and none of the senior managers were willing to provide nuance.

Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by hef19898 on Thursday August 10, 2023 @09:32AM (#37075952)
Selling something in one quarter, with the understanding that the customer returns it the next, is also clean cut accounting fraud.
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by acdha on Thursday August 10, 2023 @10:38AM (#37076729)
Yeah, every part of this was a “don’t incentivize doing this”. I doubt anyone would ever be caught for that since there was nothing in writing but it was a complete farce of management. I heard those details over a beer with one of the people involved and he was basically wryly chuckling about how that vendor had good engineers and terrible management. They’re gone now so that caught up with them.
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by mangodrunk on Friday August 11, 2023 @10:03PM (#37096230)
That can be gamed as well: you could either change the scope or cut corners and ship something of lower quality.
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by basicoperation on Thursday August 10, 2023 @02:56AM (#37072867)
In general, people often forget that if your target is a ratio, you can attack the numerator or the denominator. Often the latter is the easier to manipulate.
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by sn41 on Thursday August 10, 2023 @03:19AM (#37073027)
Bravo! In one sentence, you have captured the COVID statistics shenanigans of some countries. (roughly the strategy is: Go sample where you're sure there are no patients - "hey, we have this under control! look at the test positivity ratio!" /s)
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by iLoveOncall on Thursday August 10, 2023 @05:55AM (#37074025)
Even if it's not a ratio. When any metric becomes a target it will be gamed.

My organization tracks how many tickets we have had open for 30 days or more. So my team started to close tickets after 30 days and let them reopen automatically.

Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by darkmarmot on Thursday August 10, 2023 @07:34AM (#37074786)
Lower death rate in hospitals by sending sick people to hospice! https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-care/doctors-say-hca-h...
Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by nerdponx on Thursday August 10, 2023 @09:14AM (#37075744)
Meanwhile that's not necessarily a bad outcome. In theory it makes the data better by focusing on deaths that might or might not have been preventable, rather than making every hospital look responsible for inevitable deaths.

Of course the actual behavior in the article is highly disturbing.

Re:CNET is deleting old articles to try to improve its Googl... by baggachipz on Thursday August 10, 2023 @09:19AM (#37075794)
This is exactly how Red Ventures runs their companies. Make that chart on the wall tv go up, get promotion.